Call of Cthulhu RPG series help needed
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1Maddz
The Call of Cthulhu RPG series needs cleaning up and sorting into groups. Does anyone want to help with this project? I've been nibbling away at the variant settings and the Miskatonic University Library Association monographs, but the core Chaosium series wants work, and I haven't really been involved in CoC circles for a number of years.
My proposal is to split it into:
Core: the Chaosium BRP-based rulesets and accessories
Alternative systems & settings: this would be for the core rules of CoC games using different rules. Each system would have it's own series - e.g. Achtung! Cthulhu
Settings & Sourcebooks: BRP-based different settings, sourcebooks etc
Scenarios: the BRP-based scenarios
For the latter 2, I would suggest not including any variant system sourcebooks, settings and scenarios - they can go into the relevant system series.
I'm not sure what to do about the monographs; I've tidied up the series and added missing items to include all 80 monographs (yes, there are gaps in the numbering). I've also combined as much as possible. I've marked it as a publisher series instead of a regular series. However, I feel that adding all 80 monographs to the main series is going to clutter it up as they are split between sourcebooks, settings and scenarios and would need to be added to the appropriate group.
What do people think? And any volunteers?
My proposal is to split it into:
Core: the Chaosium BRP-based rulesets and accessories
Alternative systems & settings: this would be for the core rules of CoC games using different rules. Each system would have it's own series - e.g. Achtung! Cthulhu
Settings & Sourcebooks: BRP-based different settings, sourcebooks etc
Scenarios: the BRP-based scenarios
For the latter 2, I would suggest not including any variant system sourcebooks, settings and scenarios - they can go into the relevant system series.
I'm not sure what to do about the monographs; I've tidied up the series and added missing items to include all 80 monographs (yes, there are gaps in the numbering). I've also combined as much as possible. I've marked it as a publisher series instead of a regular series. However, I feel that adding all 80 monographs to the main series is going to clutter it up as they are split between sourcebooks, settings and scenarios and would need to be added to the appropriate group.
What do people think? And any volunteers?
2andyl
Hmm it is difficult.
I think that keeping the core stuff (the professionally published Chaosium) stuff separate is a good idea. I would expect that MULA and Miskatonic University to have their own series (just as I would expect the Jonstown Compendium to be separate to the core Runequest Glorantha stuff).
Achtung! Cthulhu is an interesting one. It was originally for Call of Cthulhu 6 and contained stats for that system. There were also versions of some of the books for Savage Worlds and for FATE. I think there was even a PDQ version of one of the adventures Then a Call of Cthulhu 7 version was released. Now it is coming out for the 2d20 system. That seems as if it should be its own series.
There are also a number of 3rd party scenarios and settings. Do we need the Cthulhu Britannica or World War Cthulhu or the books by Golden Goblin or Pagan or Stygian Fox or Grenadier Models etc in the main series or should they be their own section or even own series?
Many of the settings have separately published adventures. For example Cthulhu Dark Ages or Cthulhu Now or Down Darker Trails.
So it sounds rather complicated to me and I have no easy answers - which is probably why I have never really touched it.
I think that keeping the core stuff (the professionally published Chaosium) stuff separate is a good idea. I would expect that MULA and Miskatonic University to have their own series (just as I would expect the Jonstown Compendium to be separate to the core Runequest Glorantha stuff).
Achtung! Cthulhu is an interesting one. It was originally for Call of Cthulhu 6 and contained stats for that system. There were also versions of some of the books for Savage Worlds and for FATE. I think there was even a PDQ version of one of the adventures Then a Call of Cthulhu 7 version was released. Now it is coming out for the 2d20 system. That seems as if it should be its own series.
There are also a number of 3rd party scenarios and settings. Do we need the Cthulhu Britannica or World War Cthulhu or the books by Golden Goblin or Pagan or Stygian Fox or Grenadier Models etc in the main series or should they be their own section or even own series?
Many of the settings have separately published adventures. For example Cthulhu Dark Ages or Cthulhu Now or Down Darker Trails.
So it sounds rather complicated to me and I have no easy answers - which is probably why I have never really touched it.
3Maddz
If you take a look at Achtung! Cthulhu, you'll see what I did there. I've split out the various versions of the rule books and scenarios, and pulled in missing titles and combined, so it's probably not too bad now.
MULAm I've added missing titles and combined, but as it's been numbered as per the publisher reference number, I made it a publisher series and didn't bother distinguishing between settings/sourcebooks and scenarios.
MULAm I've added missing titles and combined, but as it's been numbered as per the publisher reference number, I made it a publisher series and didn't bother distinguishing between settings/sourcebooks and scenarios.
4andyl
>3 Maddz:
I think some more work is needed on Achtung! Cthulhu.
I think that there may be combination issues and issues in the series labelling as well.
My copy of Three Kings is the Cthulhu 6 version - although it seems to be labelled as "Zero Point 1 (Call of Cthulhu 7th edition)" on the Acthung Cthulhu series but just "(Call of Cthulhu)" on the "Zero Point" series.
There was also not a combined Call of Cthulhu / Savage Worlds edition of Three Kings. The CoC 6 version was a different book to the Savage Worlds book.
I am gaming tonight but I might have a chance tomorrow to take a look. I think I have to add all the various versions that I have - I think I have only catalogued the CoC 6e versions.
I think some more work is needed on Achtung! Cthulhu.
I think that there may be combination issues and issues in the series labelling as well.
My copy of Three Kings is the Cthulhu 6 version - although it seems to be labelled as "Zero Point 1 (Call of Cthulhu 7th edition)" on the Acthung Cthulhu series but just "(Call of Cthulhu)" on the "Zero Point" series.
There was also not a combined Call of Cthulhu / Savage Worlds edition of Three Kings. The CoC 6 version was a different book to the Savage Worlds book.
I am gaming tonight but I might have a chance tomorrow to take a look. I think I have to add all the various versions that I have - I think I have only catalogued the CoC 6e versions.
5Maddz
>4 andyl: Quite likely there were errors on my part! I don't actually own any of that version (as far as I know - there may be some PDFs lurking on a hard drive); I ended up doing what I did because I was logging some BRP titles I own and came in via the Sarah Newton author page...
The separations and combinations I did were based on different covers. It's likely some is best guess, so feel free to make corrections! I did ask Kevin Miller to distinguish his copies of the CoC 7e versions from the SW/6e editions so I could split them out correctly; they are now their own entry.
I took the view that 7e was sufficiently different to 6e to warrant their own version, you may disagree. I haven't routinely played CoC since the early 90s, I really only play occasional convention games.
I think the popular RPGs are going to be a bit of a nightmare to tidy up...
The separations and combinations I did were based on different covers. It's likely some is best guess, so feel free to make corrections! I did ask Kevin Miller to distinguish his copies of the CoC 7e versions from the SW/6e editions so I could split them out correctly; they are now their own entry.
I took the view that 7e was sufficiently different to 6e to warrant their own version, you may disagree. I haven't routinely played CoC since the early 90s, I really only play occasional convention games.
I think the popular RPGs are going to be a bit of a nightmare to tidy up...
6andyl
>5 Maddz:
Yep I backed the original KS so I have most of the PDFs. So I can probably get a lot of things straight.
Yep I backed the original KS so I have most of the PDFs. So I can probably get a lot of things straight.
7Maddz
>6 andyl: Well, I've made significant progress.
At the moment, I'm adding everything CoC related as I come across it (there's still a lot of the monographs missing, and related systems like Trail of Cthulhu). As I do so, I'm trying to split by setting, with the default being Cthulhu Classic.
The idea will be to hive off each setting into a related subseries, and put any non-Chaosium products into the subseries only. This will cause problems with Delta Green though as I don't think Chaosium ever published any of that line. There could be a case for having a Third Party Published Settings group for related settings and just keeping the core rules in there.
RPGGeek has been the best source of information, although I sometimes disagree with how things are classified. I've also been checking publisher websites (when extant - I'm not faffing around with Wayback Machine), and occasionally RPG.net.
What do you think?
At the moment, I'm adding everything CoC related as I come across it (there's still a lot of the monographs missing, and related systems like Trail of Cthulhu). As I do so, I'm trying to split by setting, with the default being Cthulhu Classic.
The idea will be to hive off each setting into a related subseries, and put any non-Chaosium products into the subseries only. This will cause problems with Delta Green though as I don't think Chaosium ever published any of that line. There could be a case for having a Third Party Published Settings group for related settings and just keeping the core rules in there.
RPGGeek has been the best source of information, although I sometimes disagree with how things are classified. I've also been checking publisher websites (when extant - I'm not faffing around with Wayback Machine), and occasionally RPG.net.
What do you think?
8Maddz
>6 andyl: Oh, I notice you've got some of the Stygian Fox publications - what's Fox Country #5? It's not listed on the Geek, and I'm finding information on a definitive list hard to find as I'm not on Facebook.
9anglemark
I don't have anything to add; I've never been systematic about CoC, but I'm sitting by the wayside and applauding your efforts.
10andyl
>8 Maddz:
Looking at the releases that should probably be Nightmare on the Necropolis Express which was the patreon release between Nakuko and Thorston but it doesn't carry the "Fox Country 5" label on the cover or on the inside material or on the original filename.
Looking at the releases that should probably be Nightmare on the Necropolis Express which was the patreon release between Nakuko and Thorston but it doesn't carry the "Fox Country 5" label on the cover or on the inside material or on the original filename.
11andyl
>7 Maddz:
On Delta Green the old stuff was for Call of Cthulhu. However all the new stuff (post 2019) is for the new Delta Green game which has its own system (which is still d100 based) which is different.
On Delta Green the old stuff was for Call of Cthulhu. However all the new stuff (post 2019) is for the new Delta Green game which has its own system (which is still d100 based) which is different.
12Maddz
>11 andyl: So basically I can drop anything published by Arc Dream from the Call of Cthulhu listing and only have it in the Delta Green listing? That would fit with my ideas for the main listing.
I wonder if there ought to be 2 series for Delta Green then. I think I will leave it up to somebody else to sort when I finish my work on the main series; I've never played any version of Delta Green, but I have some of the Pagan editions in my library (I don't think I have any Arc Dream editions).
I wonder if there ought to be 2 series for Delta Green then. I think I will leave it up to somebody else to sort when I finish my work on the main series; I've never played any version of Delta Green, but I have some of the Pagan editions in my library (I don't think I have any Arc Dream editions).
13andyl
>11 andyl:
Kinda. The Cthulhu Delta Green books (actual published paper ones) were Delta Green, Eyes Only, Targets of Opportunity. There was also Delta Green: Aventuras in Spanish.
However much of Eyes Only and Targets of Opportunity were originally published separately, plus people may have catalogued web published stuff (much of which has been reworked into scenarios for the new Delta Green game and retain the same name).
I definitely think Delta Green needs its own series as it will cover three games (there is The Fall of Delta Green using Gumshoe rules).
I have also been working on the main series - basically addng in some of the stuff I have which wasn't in the series. I have also moved Utatti Asfet into the Scenarios group as it is a globe-trotting campaign.
Kinda. The Cthulhu Delta Green books (actual published paper ones) were Delta Green, Eyes Only, Targets of Opportunity. There was also Delta Green: Aventuras in Spanish.
However much of Eyes Only and Targets of Opportunity were originally published separately, plus people may have catalogued web published stuff (much of which has been reworked into scenarios for the new Delta Green game and retain the same name).
I definitely think Delta Green needs its own series as it will cover three games (there is The Fall of Delta Green using Gumshoe rules).
I have also been working on the main series - basically addng in some of the stuff I have which wasn't in the series. I have also moved Utatti Asfet into the Scenarios group as it is a globe-trotting campaign.
14Maddz
>13 andyl: There is a Delta Green series linked off the main CoC series...
I think I've got more or less everything that's been catalogued in there, so feel free to use that as you see fit.
My gut feeling with RPGs is that the Core group is the main rule books and GM screens, then you have a Sourcebooks group, a Scenarios group and perhaps a (campaign) Settings group (or groups if there are multiple settings) plus any other related core material that doesn't fit anywhere else.
I think I've got more or less everything that's been catalogued in there, so feel free to use that as you see fit.
My gut feeling with RPGs is that the Core group is the main rule books and GM screens, then you have a Sourcebooks group, a Scenarios group and perhaps a (campaign) Settings group (or groups if there are multiple settings) plus any other related core material that doesn't fit anywhere else.
15andyl
>14 Maddz:
Yep the DG series looks good at first glance.
Yep your general gut feel seems right to me. I think the MULA stuff is a little more confusing as it could easily be in the MULA section or in one of the other sections (there were sourcebooks, and scenarios - for different settings).
BTW having looked through the series so far I have found a number of works I have neglected to catalogue. So it has already been useful to me.
Yep the DG series looks good at first glance.
Yep your general gut feel seems right to me. I think the MULA stuff is a little more confusing as it could easily be in the MULA section or in one of the other sections (there were sourcebooks, and scenarios - for different settings).
BTW having looked through the series so far I have found a number of works I have neglected to catalogue. So it has already been useful to me.
16andyl
Should Realms of Cthulhu appear at all? It is a similar setting for the Savage Worlds system.
17Maddz
>16 andyl: At the moment I'm being completist; to start with I'd rather add too much than miss things. I think once things have been identified and added, then we can discuss include or exclude on a case-by-case basis.
Is it part of Achtung! Cthulhu?
Is it part of Achtung! Cthulhu?
18Maddz
The Cthulhu Now group should be ready to split into it's own series.
I'm going to finish sorting the last of the random titles in the core section before heading back out to the garden (I hit the garden centres yesterday).
I'm going to finish sorting the last of the random titles in the core section before heading back out to the garden (I hit the garden centres yesterday).
19andyl
>17 Maddz:
No - more the other way round. Realms of Cthulhu was just a ruleset for running Cthulhu style adventures in Savage Worlds. It got very little support at the time - just a couple of very short adventures online. Then when Achtung! Cthulhu was published sometime later it was one of the rulesets they targetted in addition to Call of Cthulhu.
No - more the other way round. Realms of Cthulhu was just a ruleset for running Cthulhu style adventures in Savage Worlds. It got very little support at the time - just a couple of very short adventures online. Then when Achtung! Cthulhu was published sometime later it was one of the rulesets they targetted in addition to Call of Cthulhu.
20Maddz
>19 andyl: Sounds like it should be added to Achtung as the first edition core rules...
Anyway, the last 10 then I can get back to planting out veg.
Anyway, the last 10 then I can get back to planting out veg.
21Maddz
Right, I've finished the initial run-through, and cleared everything out of the Core group that wasn't rules or GM screens. The GM screens need looking at and assigning to the correct edition; and do we want to split the core rules entry into the various editions? (Games Workshop boxed set, I'm looking at you.)
(1) Ensure the campaign settings have been split into their own series, checking RPGGeek for what should be there.
(2) Mark any entry that shouldn't be included in the main list as a REMOVE group or a Third party content group.
(3) Go through the RPGGeek CoC list and ensure everything there is entered appropriately. Any third party content not in the main or REMOVE groups are listed in the Third party content group.
(4) REMOVE any items in that group.
(5) Then reset the series to Custom Order (at the moment it's automatic by label) and drag and drop into the various groups (I wish there was a way to sort by group automatically!)
The garden now calls!
(1) Ensure the campaign settings have been split into their own series, checking RPGGeek for what should be there.
(2) Mark any entry that shouldn't be included in the main list as a REMOVE group or a Third party content group.
(3) Go through the RPGGeek CoC list and ensure everything there is entered appropriately. Any third party content not in the main or REMOVE groups are listed in the Third party content group.
(4) REMOVE any items in that group.
(5) Then reset the series to Custom Order (at the moment it's automatic by label) and drag and drop into the various groups (I wish there was a way to sort by group automatically!)
The garden now calls!
22andyl
>21 Maddz:
Dire Documents probably needs moving out of the Core. It is a collection of letterheads, forms, and other props - ignore the summary on LT which is incorrect.
Dire Documents probably needs moving out of the Core. It is a collection of letterheads, forms, and other props - ignore the summary on LT which is incorrect.
23Maddz
>22 andyl: An Accessories group then? I haven't noticed any dice or figures so far... Or HPLHS props.
There's potentially a room for a fiction group (it seems to have it's own series already but how up-to-date it is moot), and probably a Media group (HPLHS Dark Radio Theatre songbooks, CDs & DVDs).
There's potentially a room for a fiction group (it seems to have it's own series already but how up-to-date it is moot), and probably a Media group (HPLHS Dark Radio Theatre songbooks, CDs & DVDs).
25Maddz
>24 andyl: Ah, is it for adults or kiddies?
26andyl
>25 Maddz:
Teenage and above I think. Same as The Runequest Coloring Book (which I don't think has been catalogued yet).
Teenage and above I think. Same as The Runequest Coloring Book (which I don't think has been catalogued yet).
27Maddz
>26 andyl: I was being facetious!
Don't worry about the RQ - it's in the list to be catalogued (but I've only got to C and still haven't sorted Blades in the Dark...)
Don't worry about the RQ - it's in the list to be catalogued (but I've only got to C and still haven't sorted Blades in the Dark...)
28Maddz
All the settings have their subseries created and populated.
Next to check on RPGGeek for what's been missed. I also need to check Drivethru for PegasusSpiele editions as looking for one volume I found others which didn't seem to be in there. Sigh.
Next to check on RPGGeek for what's been missed. I also need to check Drivethru for PegasusSpiele editions as looking for one volume I found others which didn't seem to be in there. Sigh.
29anglemark
What is your take on translations? I'm thinking in particular of the Swedish translation of CoC 7th, which has added a lot of local stuff to the core books, and has original scenarios. Combine with the US editions or a separate subseries?
30andyl
>29 anglemark:
I would keep it separated from any other edition, but it should be part of the series.
I would keep it separated from any other edition, but it should be part of the series.
31anglemark
>30 andyl: Perhaps a subseries called Call of Cthulhu Sverige (Swedish) that collects all books, core books, scenarios, sourcebooks?
32andyl
>28 Maddz:
Quick question. Are you using 'Cthulhu Now' just for stuff that was released with that branding - or any adventure set in the 90s, or any modern-era adventure?
Whichever I think we need to do some movements.
Ramsey Campbell's Goatswood is branded as 'Cthulhu Now' on the cover.
A number of the Stygian Fox works are set in the modern day (similarly some which are gaslight). I can go through and correct these when I have some spare time.
Secrets is set in the 1990s and is labelled as such on the cover.
I am not sure what to do with Curse of the Yellow Sign - it comprises of 3 adventures. One (Digging For a Dead God) set in 1939, one (Calling the King) set in roughly Cthulhu Now territory, and one (Archimedes VII) set in the far future. At the moment the book containing all 3 acts, and Digging for a Dead God are in the Cthulhu Now section. Maybe move Digging For A Dead God and the main book to Scenarios.
I am a bit confused by Setting and Sourcebook. Some works in sourcebook are really what I would call a setting. For example H.P. Lovecraft's Arkham: Unveiling The Legend and Arkham Unveiled: Adventures and Background in the Home of Miskatonic University are sourcbooks but The Compact Arkham Unveiled is a setting. All three are variants of the same material (with enough differences for them to be kept separate).
Fatal Experiments is in the wrong section. It is not a setting. It is a collection of 3 scenarios (set in the 1920s) and an article on guns. It should probably be moved to Scenarios.
Realms of Cthulhu is currently in Settings. I don't think this is right. I think it probably ought to be removed. It is nothing to do with Call of Cthulhu.
BTW I still have a lot of magazines to catalogue and add to the series. Maybe a few other works (which exist as PDF only) too.
Quick question. Are you using 'Cthulhu Now' just for stuff that was released with that branding - or any adventure set in the 90s, or any modern-era adventure?
Whichever I think we need to do some movements.
Ramsey Campbell's Goatswood is branded as 'Cthulhu Now' on the cover.
A number of the Stygian Fox works are set in the modern day (similarly some which are gaslight). I can go through and correct these when I have some spare time.
Secrets is set in the 1990s and is labelled as such on the cover.
I am not sure what to do with Curse of the Yellow Sign - it comprises of 3 adventures. One (Digging For a Dead God) set in 1939, one (Calling the King) set in roughly Cthulhu Now territory, and one (Archimedes VII) set in the far future. At the moment the book containing all 3 acts, and Digging for a Dead God are in the Cthulhu Now section. Maybe move Digging For A Dead God and the main book to Scenarios.
I am a bit confused by Setting and Sourcebook. Some works in sourcebook are really what I would call a setting. For example H.P. Lovecraft's Arkham: Unveiling The Legend and Arkham Unveiled: Adventures and Background in the Home of Miskatonic University are sourcbooks but The Compact Arkham Unveiled is a setting. All three are variants of the same material (with enough differences for them to be kept separate).
Fatal Experiments is in the wrong section. It is not a setting. It is a collection of 3 scenarios (set in the 1920s) and an article on guns. It should probably be moved to Scenarios.
Realms of Cthulhu is currently in Settings. I don't think this is right. I think it probably ought to be removed. It is nothing to do with Call of Cthulhu.
BTW I still have a lot of magazines to catalogue and add to the series. Maybe a few other works (which exist as PDF only) too.
33Maddz
>31 anglemark: We really need the same for the German translations... They are practically a different game.
The other question is do we split out Chaosium editions 1-6? 7th Edition is stand-alone already, and some of the supplements have had different editions combined.
The other question is do we split out Chaosium editions 1-6? 7th Edition is stand-alone already, and some of the supplements have had different editions combined.
34Maddz
>32 andyl: For Cthulhu Now, I'm going by what's included in RPGGeek as part of the series list. (Ditto the other settings...). Feel free to amend! (As I mentioned earlier, I've largely not played CoC routinely since the 1990s...)
For the other comments, I was going by the first category entry in RPGGeek, and I realise that was the wrong approach - categories are ordered alphabetically, not by importance. Again, make what changes you feel are appropriate. It would be something I pick up on when doing the final CoC cross-reference when checking the non-setting specific material (it's been done for the specific setting series, and should have been done in the main CoC series).
I'm also not sure about what to do with the SF material. Do we want a CoC (SF) series?
Anyway, feel free to make what amendments you see fit. I probably won't do much this week as I'm on a 3-day training course then I have a deadline for a Friday meeting...
For the other comments, I was going by the first category entry in RPGGeek, and I realise that was the wrong approach - categories are ordered alphabetically, not by importance. Again, make what changes you feel are appropriate. It would be something I pick up on when doing the final CoC cross-reference when checking the non-setting specific material (it's been done for the specific setting series, and should have been done in the main CoC series).
I'm also not sure about what to do with the SF material. Do we want a CoC (SF) series?
Anyway, feel free to make what amendments you see fit. I probably won't do much this week as I'm on a 3-day training course then I have a deadline for a Friday meeting...
36anglemark
>33 Maddz: As for core rules editions, that's a tricky one. The difference between some editions is tiny, but significant for others. Perhaps we keep the core rules editions separate, but combine editions of supplements? I feel that the difference is smaller there. If that's not too arcane and complicated a rule to uphold.
As for Swedish (and German editions), they should really be their own series, shouldn't they? Considering that you have to set the language of a series.
As for Swedish (and German editions), they should really be their own series, shouldn't they? Considering that you have to set the language of a series.
37Maddz
>36 anglemark: The geek groups CoC as 2nd-6th, and has 7th separate, but within each entry, the different editions are separate items. (Does that make sense?)
Oddly, sourcebooks and scenarios are often separate items...
Oddly, sourcebooks and scenarios are often separate items...
38Maddz
Update: CoC 7th edition titles on RPGGeek have now been logged when they exist on LT. A lot of online-only titles don't exist, and Japanese and Polish editions.
I think I've got pretty all the Pegasus Spiele titles, we were muttering about a separate series for the Swedish editions (which I haven't seen yet) and the German editions.
Should 7th edition be split into it's own series and separate section within the CoC main series?
Next up: the main CoC up to 6th edition pages on RPGGeek; all 700 entries!
I think I've got pretty all the Pegasus Spiele titles, we were muttering about a separate series for the Swedish editions (which I haven't seen yet) and the German editions.
Should 7th edition be split into it's own series and separate section within the CoC main series?
Next up: the main CoC up to 6th edition pages on RPGGeek; all 700 entries!
39Maddz
Made a start on the German editions. If anyone wants to tackle splitting out the German players handbook from here, https://www.librarything.com/work/23238/editions/68109799, please feel free!
Also, the German series, Call of Cthulhu RPG (Deutsche) will need German translations to the series text & groups (preferably after I've added the books!).
Also, the German series, Call of Cthulhu RPG (Deutsche) will need German translations to the series text & groups (preferably after I've added the books!).
40anglemark
>38 Maddz: I figured that separate languages have separate series under the Series system, so I created it separately: https://www.librarything.com/nseries/325894/Call-of-Cthulhu-Sverige
41Maddz
>40 anglemark: Yeah, it will need linking to the main series. I'd consider including the core rules in the main series too, but probably not anything else.
42Maddz
Can somebody with more knowledge than me deal with the English Lovecraft Country (Call of Cthulhu RPG) and the German https://www.librarything.com/nseries/326051/Lovecraft-Country-Collection-Cthulhu... I'll be adding the German books to the newly-created series (no touchstone yet) as I go along. (Also, RPGGeek comments that there are a couple of other books that can be considered part of the series - but weren't marketed as such.)
Specifically, how do the 9 books in the English series relate to the 6 books in the German series? I've sort of done it for https://www.librarything.com/work/26743445 but I'm missing one relationship (not being sure which is meant as the second Arkham sourcebook). As far as I can see, the German books are either the source material or scenario collections, so I think disambiguation notices and descriptions are also needed.
References:
https://rpggeek.com/rpgseries/1300/lovecraft-country-series
https://rpggeek.com/rpgseries/4200/lovecraft-country-collection
ETA: #6 Dunwich - Grauen in den Hügeln does not appear to be catalogued in LT.
Specifically, how do the 9 books in the English series relate to the 6 books in the German series? I've sort of done it for https://www.librarything.com/work/26743445 but I'm missing one relationship (not being sure which is meant as the second Arkham sourcebook). As far as I can see, the German books are either the source material or scenario collections, so I think disambiguation notices and descriptions are also needed.
References:
https://rpggeek.com/rpgseries/1300/lovecraft-country-series
https://rpggeek.com/rpgseries/4200/lovecraft-country-collection
ETA: #6 Dunwich - Grauen in den Hügeln does not appear to be catalogued in LT.
43andyl
>42 Maddz:
Grauen in Arkham appears to be a book of scenarios drawing from at least 3 English books.
But generally I don't know enough about the German sub-series.
Grauen in Arkham appears to be a book of scenarios drawing from at least 3 English books.
But generally I don't know enough about the German sub-series.
44andyl
>42 Maddz: Maddz have you also seen https://www.yog-sothoth.com/wiki/index.php/CoC:Supplements which might help a bit.
45Maddz
>44 andyl: Thanks, I’ll check it out when I get home.
46Maddz
The German series is now complete as far as I can see. I need now to remove scenarios and sourcebooks from the main series, just leaving the core rules.
47Maddz
>44 andyl:, >45 Maddz: That was a mistake on my part. I completed logging all the Pegasus products on RPGGeek, now I've found Cthulhu - Das Rollenspiel. There's also the issue there's still German editions combined into https://www.librarything.com/work/23238/editions/68109799
Do the Rollenspiel books get added to the German page or get a separate series?
ETA the core books are added, the others can go there as well.
ETA 2 Given how the German versions worked (different versions relate to different editions, I am tempted to split out the different editions of the English core rules.
Do the Rollenspiel books get added to the German page or get a separate series?
ETA the core books are added, the others can go there as well.
ETA 2 Given how the German versions worked (different versions relate to different editions, I am tempted to split out the different editions of the English core rules.
48Maddz
Started on doing a custom sort of the main series. My hands are now well sore with all the scrolling up and down.
It's really too big to do custom sorts manually; I am seriously considering splitting the scenarios (split into Miskatonic Repository and anything else), sourcebooks and campaign settings into their own series, and deleting out any of the other books that are already in their own series. This has the advantage that any publication which has multiple possible types can go in the applicable series.
I don't know...
It's really too big to do custom sorts manually; I am seriously considering splitting the scenarios (split into Miskatonic Repository and anything else), sourcebooks and campaign settings into their own series, and deleting out any of the other books that are already in their own series. This has the advantage that any publication which has multiple possible types can go in the applicable series.
I don't know...
49andyl
>48 Maddz:
Yep. If the MULA stuff is split out then the Miskatonic Repository should be split out into their own subseries. I guess there are probably many dozens of other Miskatonic Repository items. The ones that are there in the series are the ones I own. Although having said that The Unbearable Likeness a Stygian Fox scenario is also published as part of the Miskatonic Repository.
Yep. If the MULA stuff is split out then the Miskatonic Repository should be split out into their own subseries. I guess there are probably many dozens of other Miskatonic Repository items. The ones that are there in the series are the ones I own. Although having said that The Unbearable Likeness a Stygian Fox scenario is also published as part of the Miskatonic Repository.
50Maddz
Is anyone active on any of the main CoC forums?
I'm trying to find out whether https://www.librarything.com/work/14731237 is a straight translation of https://www.librarything.com/work/7615121/summary or if it's a different work (or even exists in the first place). Unfortunately, only the German version is listed on yog-sothoth or RPGGeek; there's no mention of the French version.
I'm trying to find out whether https://www.librarything.com/work/14731237 is a straight translation of https://www.librarything.com/work/7615121/summary or if it's a different work (or even exists in the first place). Unfortunately, only the German version is listed on yog-sothoth or RPGGeek; there's no mention of the French version.
51andyl
>50 Maddz:
Yep I think it is the same.
I found the following page http://www.legrog.org/jeux/appel-de-cthulhu/dementophobia-fr which gives the same ISBN as https://www.librarything.com/work/14731237
The description details the same content as described (on Yog Sothoth) for the German book.
Yep I think it is the same.
I found the following page http://www.legrog.org/jeux/appel-de-cthulhu/dementophobia-fr which gives the same ISBN as https://www.librarything.com/work/14731237
The description details the same content as described (on Yog Sothoth) for the German book.
52Maddz
>51 andyl: OK, I'll combine them.
53Maddz
What's the consensus on splitting 2nd edition Delta Green (BRP & d20) from the first edition (BRP only)? Do the additional rules warrant the split?
54Maddz
That's the French editions on Yog-Sothoth gone through. I've done my best with combining, but it's not always obvious which English edition the translation should be combined with (given that multiple editions tend to be expansions of previous editions). There's quite a lot of what I assume are 7th edition translations which don't seem to match the original English edition - these I have left uncombined.
There are also a number of new French-only books (I need to add the scenarios into the main series; at the moment they are generally only in the scenarios series).
Next up: the German editions on Y-S.
ETA: It would be helpful if someone could go through the sourcebooks, scenarios and settings in the main series and see if I've assigned things correctly. You will need to re-order things though.
Note that some of the settings have been broken out into their own group (which correspond to stand-alone series) and all related material is contained in the group not split between the generic groups. I've tended to leave non-Chaosium material in the specific groups, but moved non-Chaosium scenarios into the scenarios series.
What is possibly worth doing is to move the works in the different settings back into the generic sourcebooks/scenarios/settings sections, and split the sub-series into sourcebooks/scenarios/settings sections. I don't know; to me it would make the series incredibly unwieldy and difficult to navigate - it's bad enough as it is.
There are also a number of new French-only books (I need to add the scenarios into the main series; at the moment they are generally only in the scenarios series).
Next up: the German editions on Y-S.
ETA: It would be helpful if someone could go through the sourcebooks, scenarios and settings in the main series and see if I've assigned things correctly. You will need to re-order things though.
Note that some of the settings have been broken out into their own group (which correspond to stand-alone series) and all related material is contained in the group not split between the generic groups. I've tended to leave non-Chaosium material in the specific groups, but moved non-Chaosium scenarios into the scenarios series.
What is possibly worth doing is to move the works in the different settings back into the generic sourcebooks/scenarios/settings sections, and split the sub-series into sourcebooks/scenarios/settings sections. I don't know; to me it would make the series incredibly unwieldy and difficult to navigate - it's bad enough as it is.
55Maddz
Yay! I think I'm about done...
That's the last of the translated works from Y-S.com gone through. I've done my best to combine them with the correct English versions; I had to cross-reference with RPGGeek, and it didn't help that most pages were stubs with no details. It might be worth running a check on RPGGeek for ISBNs; unfortunately, a lot of the translated titles aren't in the alternate titles field so you have to dig around in the entries.
I think the German editions are pretty well complete, the French are around 75%, and the Spanish around 50%. Other languages were mostly not logged here bar a few editions here and there. The Asian editions were not found apart from the 2 Japanese with full pages on Y-S.com. I'm rather guessing about them; they were found via an ISBN search and I think I've categorised them correctly.
I am not going to try searching the Miskatonic Repository; my experience is that most of these PDFs are not being logged - only the pro-published ones are.
It would be helpful if someone could proof-read the series, especially to check the group assignments. Anyway, I now have an appointment with the garden (the plant cages have arrived and I have a lot of brassicas to plant out over the weekend - weather permitting).
That's the last of the translated works from Y-S.com gone through. I've done my best to combine them with the correct English versions; I had to cross-reference with RPGGeek, and it didn't help that most pages were stubs with no details. It might be worth running a check on RPGGeek for ISBNs; unfortunately, a lot of the translated titles aren't in the alternate titles field so you have to dig around in the entries.
I think the German editions are pretty well complete, the French are around 75%, and the Spanish around 50%. Other languages were mostly not logged here bar a few editions here and there. The Asian editions were not found apart from the 2 Japanese with full pages on Y-S.com. I'm rather guessing about them; they were found via an ISBN search and I think I've categorised them correctly.
I am not going to try searching the Miskatonic Repository; my experience is that most of these PDFs are not being logged - only the pro-published ones are.
It would be helpful if someone could proof-read the series, especially to check the group assignments. Anyway, I now have an appointment with the garden (the plant cages have arrived and I have a lot of brassicas to plant out over the weekend - weather permitting).
56andyl
>55 Maddz:
Looks pretty good without me chasing the non-English copies. I've just added Punktown to the settings.
A couple of points.
1) Realms Of Cthulhu appears with Setting in the descriptor. It is not really that. It is a different game, a different ruleset, to play similar style of games. I guess you might call it an adaptation (especially if you are calling Trail of Cthulhu an adaptation). As there are other adaptations Cthulhu Dark and The Cthulhu Hack to other rulesets which are not included I wonder if we need to include Realms of Cthulhu at all. Or if we do then we should include those other games for consistency. But then you are opening it up to a whole heap of games which are very similar.
2) I see you have included Cthulhu Live. Maybe that should be a series relationship with a role adaptation to the existing Cthulhu Live series as there are various other Cthulhu Live items besides the main rules.
Looks pretty good without me chasing the non-English copies. I've just added Punktown to the settings.
A couple of points.
1) Realms Of Cthulhu appears with Setting in the descriptor. It is not really that. It is a different game, a different ruleset, to play similar style of games. I guess you might call it an adaptation (especially if you are calling Trail of Cthulhu an adaptation). As there are other adaptations Cthulhu Dark and The Cthulhu Hack to other rulesets which are not included I wonder if we need to include Realms of Cthulhu at all. Or if we do then we should include those other games for consistency. But then you are opening it up to a whole heap of games which are very similar.
2) I see you have included Cthulhu Live. Maybe that should be a series relationship with a role adaptation to the existing Cthulhu Live series as there are various other Cthulhu Live items besides the main rules.
57Maddz
>56 andyl: Probably best to have them as adaptations then, rather than keeping them in the main series. I'm not sure about the d20 adaptations either, although I don't think there's been much published yet beyond Achtung! Cthulhu? I've not noticed much bar the rulesets. Is Pulp Cthulhu an adaptation or a setting?
What I suggest then is to have an Adaptations group for the rules, but move any sourcebooks and scenarios into the adaptation series. We can also move the Delta Green ruleset into that group and drop all the other material. The German and Swedish rules can be moved there too as they are more adaptations than straight translations.
Is there a role of 'adaptation of' for series? I think I ended up using 'inspired by'.
Either way, over to you for that piece of work! I'm only going to be dipping in and out this week unless it starts raining again.
What I suggest then is to have an Adaptations group for the rules, but move any sourcebooks and scenarios into the adaptation series. We can also move the Delta Green ruleset into that group and drop all the other material. The German and Swedish rules can be moved there too as they are more adaptations than straight translations.
Is there a role of 'adaptation of' for series? I think I ended up using 'inspired by'.
Either way, over to you for that piece of work! I'm only going to be dipping in and out this week unless it starts raining again.
58andyl
>57 Maddz:
Pulp Cthulhu is basically the same but with a few tweaks (more hit points, more skill points, some special features). It has a very strong connection to CoC 7e (and in fact you really need the Keeper's Handbook). Similarly the D20 game actually carries the Call of Cthulhu name on it and so probably is more closely linked than some. Achtung Cthulhu functions a bit strangely - I mainly think of it as primarily a series of sourcebooks and scenarios for Call of Cthulhu but then there is all the ports to other systems (Savage Worlds, FATE, PDQ, and now its own 2D20 system). It definitely feels a bit like Delta Green which was originally just material for Call of Cthulhu and then moved beyond it.
I will look at that when I have some time. I will probably also look at making a series for The Cthulhu Hack.
Pulp Cthulhu is basically the same but with a few tweaks (more hit points, more skill points, some special features). It has a very strong connection to CoC 7e (and in fact you really need the Keeper's Handbook). Similarly the D20 game actually carries the Call of Cthulhu name on it and so probably is more closely linked than some. Achtung Cthulhu functions a bit strangely - I mainly think of it as primarily a series of sourcebooks and scenarios for Call of Cthulhu but then there is all the ports to other systems (Savage Worlds, FATE, PDQ, and now its own 2D20 system). It definitely feels a bit like Delta Green which was originally just material for Call of Cthulhu and then moved beyond it.
I will look at that when I have some time. I will probably also look at making a series for The Cthulhu Hack.
59Maddz
And I've done. I've gone through all 77 pages of CoC 2nd - 6th edition on RPGGeek; I've picked up some more scenarios and translations, and combined and separated others.
As I mentioned before, PDF-only works are unlikely to be logged here, especially self-published short scenarios. I'm not touching the Miskatonic Repository with a barge pole; the Drivethru interface is not good.
So if somebody would like to proof-read my assignments in Call of Cthulhu RPG, Call of Cthulhu RPG Scenarios, and Cthulhu RPG (Deutsche) and make what corrections they want, please feel free!
I will now get back to logging my CoC collection - after dealing with laundry.
As I mentioned before, PDF-only works are unlikely to be logged here, especially self-published short scenarios. I'm not touching the Miskatonic Repository with a barge pole; the Drivethru interface is not good.
So if somebody would like to proof-read my assignments in Call of Cthulhu RPG, Call of Cthulhu RPG Scenarios, and Cthulhu RPG (Deutsche) and make what corrections they want, please feel free!
I will now get back to logging my CoC collection - after dealing with laundry.
60anglemark
>59 Maddz: Why not combine the two activities? The Laundry
61Maddz
>60 anglemark: It's further down the list of games in PDF to log (I've also 8 of the books in print copies). By the look of it, the series is more or less up to date.
62anglemark
>61 Maddz: Sorry, I was just trying to be funny!
63Maddz
>62 anglemark: I guessed! I have to go through RuneQuest RPG first...(eek!) I did some work on the the original series (along with Judges Guild), and I expect a lot will need refreshing. At least I don't play D&D so don't need to worry about that series!
My RPG print copies are 905% logged; there's been a couple of additions, and I need to log Paul's books. PDFs I'm badly behind on the logging which is my current project (when I'm not being sidetracked by updating the series!)
My RPG print copies are 905% logged; there's been a couple of additions, and I need to log Paul's books. PDFs I'm badly behind on the logging which is my current project (when I'm not being sidetracked by updating the series!)
