Baswood's books, music films etc part 3

Time to take stock on projected reads for the next quarter

The Italian Renaissance
Renaissance in Italy John Addington Symonds; more volumes in this excellent series to read
Renaissance, Andrew Graham-Dixon
Meditations on the Soul Marsilio Ficino
Baiae Giovani Pontano
Hypnerotomachia Poliphili; The strife of Love in a dream, Joscelyn Godwin
Lucrezia Borgia, Maria Bellonci
The Prince, Machiavelli
The Comedies of Machiavelli
Five Italian Renaissance comedies
Erasmus-Discourse on Free Will

D H Lawrence
The collected letters of D H Lawrence vol 2
The collected short stories
A Propos of Lady Chatterley's Lover and Other Essays
Flame into Being Anthony Burgess

Arthurian Legends
The Alliterative Morte Arthure, John Gardner
The Holy Grail; The history of a Legend Richard Barker
Porius John Cowper Powys

Book Club Reads
Lost in Translation, Eva Hoffman
Wuthering Heights Emily Bronte
Riders in the Chariot Patrick White

And of course anything else that takes my fancy

I worried about this thread now. If books and films have taught me anything it is that the third installation is usually a disappointment.

Patrick White milking a cow at his farm; Dogwoods Australia

Lol Turner, "Godfather 3" the exception I think

Voss - Patrick White
“It is for our pride that each of us is probably damned” Laura said (to Voss)

Voss a German arrives in Australia with the purpose of leading an expedition across the unexplored breadth of the country. The novel is set in the mid nineteenth century when such a journey had not yet been made and Sydney was still a fairly small town in which a society was just emerging. Voss is a man supremely confident that he can achieve anything that he has a will to do and he gathers around him by force of personality a few sycophants while others are thrust upon him, by his sponsors led by Mr Bonner; a wealthy Sydney merchant. Laura Trevelyan niece to Mr Bonner and herself an outsider becomes fascinated by the German Explorer, she sees a kindred spirit but one like herself that is equally doomed, if redemption is not forthcoming. They meet briefly at only a handful of social occasions, before Voss departs, but a bond develops between them and Laura attempts to provide a sort of salvation for them both.

Patrick Whites previous novel The Tree of Man had sold well and had been critically acclaimed in England and America. Like Voss its story was set in an emergent Australia, but had received mixed reviews in White’s home country. Still keen to write the great Australian novel he decided to go further back in Australian history and deal with the mysteries of the interior. Published in 1957 it was a hit in both England and America, critically acclaimed and featuring in the best seller lists, but in Australia he again received mixed reviews, White was disgusted and was only mollified when he received the first Miles Franklin Literary Award for a novel of ‘the highest literary merit which must present Australian life in any of its phrases.’

It is not difficult to see why White’s novel did not immediately sweep all before it in Australia. The two central figures Voss and Laura are outsiders and unlovable ones at that. For all White’s writing about Voss he still remains a bit of an enigma. His overweening pride, his delight in his own suffering and one suspects the suffering of others takes him outside of accepted norms for heroic characters. Laura also fails to register much sympathy with her stand offish behaviour and pride in her own abilities The grand passion between the two is conducted via a couple of letters and then dream visions and hallucinations fill in the rest. Many of the other characters in the novel also appear as human beings with all their faults on show and the overall feeling is that the author is not much in love with the human race.

It is however an excellent novel and worthy of its critical acclaim. White has structured the novel in three unequal parts although they are not formally divided. The first part mainly set in Sydney portrays the merchant society that supports Voss’s expedition and the family life around Laura. Voss’s team are introduced and Laura’s meetings with Voss and the verbal sparring that takes place are cleverly done. The largest section of the book describes the attempt to cross the outback, White intersperses his enthralling narrative with occasional visits back to life in Sydney which contrasts with the terrible deprivations that Voss and his followers have to endure. They are not professional explorers, they are being led by a man who is variously described as ‘mad ‘ or ‘lost’ and Voss feels that his authority is challenged by the practical ex convict Judd. Things soon start to go wrong and the expedition takes on the feel of a battle of survival against insurmountable odds. White’s writing here is powerful and as hard and bright as the landscape he describes. It soon becomes clear that the expedition is doomed and the short final part deals with Laura’s psychic health and the myth making that develops around the mysteries that surround the demise of Voss and his party.

There are powerful themes running through this novel: man’s battle against the natural world, a search for a meaning to life both through belief in God (Voss as a Christ figure) and the power of love, suffering as a means to find redemption, civilization and it’s intrusion into the world of the indigenous population, which is violent and beyond comprehension and finally the myth making and legends that are such a necessary part of human existence. The novel develops its themes as the plot unfolds, in such a way that I became anxious to re-read earlier sections to find what I might have missed. This confirmed my view that White was a master of his craft. It all fits together wonderfully well and new ideas spring to mind as earlier passages resonate with events that occur later on in the book. White’s characters are superbly drawn and there are many memorable passages in the book. .

This is not a comfortable novel; events in the outback are brutal. The hard dry landscape has debilitating effects on the explorers and they are graphically described. The landscape and its deprivations also lead to dream visions that become real to the sufferers and give rise to the almost telepathic love affair between Voss and Laura. The reader must accept these as well as the depiction of the aboriginal people as filthy and repulsive; a constant menace to the explorers and their sudden violent actions shock and dismay.

I have to say that I did not enjoy Voss as much as The Tree of Man, but I think that Voss is the greater of the two novels. Perhaps not the “great” Australian novel but taken together with The Tree of Man then it could be in with a shout. It is one that I will want to re-read, because there is so much going on, so much to think about and structurally it feels so right. Recommended
.

Fabulous review of Voss, Barry. I had planned to buy The Tree of Man next week, and I may get this as well.

I wholeheartedly agree. A fabulous review, Barry. Patrick White is high on my list of authors to read and your reviews have shown that it will undoubtedly be a wonderful experience.

Terrific review. I think Turner can relax for a bit now.

Was Godfather 3 not a disappointment then Bas? Not sure...Good but certainly not great like its predecessors.

Being born an 'Australian' I have an occasional tug at the back of my mind about what it means to be australian and what the australian experience actually means...

Hadn't thought about White much before - but your reviews have brought him to life more.

Very evocative review, Barry. I've never even seen a Patrick White novel in a South African bookshop, but you and the other LTers have convinced me that I need to pay his works some attention.

Dewald, Patrick White is yet another great novelist who is not in fashion at the moment. He is not an easy read and his sentences can be surprising in that they appear as though from a line of poetry and slow you down while you digest the meaning.

zeno, of course I have no idea what being an Australian means, but would have thought that Nobel prize winning Patrick White would have some resonance with those that hail from that continent.

Thanks Dan, Linda and Darryl. I am still on course to read all of White's novels this year.

In my opinion, Godfather 3 was a disaster! And Godfather 1 & 2 are among my favorite films of all time. On the other hand, this thread is delightful and I'm sure will become as dangerous as its predecessors.

Rebecca, I'm now picturing Barry as the M Corleone of LT!

Bas there may be a whole thread in out of fashion authors we should be reading...

There should certainly be a thread on great third instalments.

Careful zeno I am reading Machiavelli at the moment.

Very funny, Zeno. Certainly some of them are books we can't refuse!

Great review, Barry, and an interesting comparison with The Tree of Man. I'm planning to read Voss myself sometime this summer.

Meditations on the Soul Selected letters of Marsilio Ficino
Poquette has written an excellent review of this book which appears on the book page and so I am just adding my thoughts.

“Painting and sculpture, and that magnificence of public life which characterized the fifteenth century, contributed to the substitution of aesthetic for moral or religious standards. Actions were estimated by the effect which they produced; and to sin against the laws of culture was of more moment than to transgress the code of |Christianity. Still, the men of the Renaissance could not forget the creed which they had drawn in with their mothers milk, but which the Church had not adjusted to the new conditions of the growing age. The result was a wild phantasmagoric chaos of confused and clashing influences.” (from Renaissance in Italy by John Addington Symonds)

Marsilio Ficino was one of these clashing influences, but seems to have remained aloof from much of the hurly burly of Renaissance life. He had the ear of the Medici family that ruled Florence in his lifetime and felt strong enough to hand out advice on morals and religion, sometimes in quite a patronising way. Ficino was engaged in translating the Greek philosopher Plato into Latin and from many of the letters in this collection he was intent on reconciling the pagan philosopher’s views with Christianity. He gathered round him a group of like minded people and they wrote to each other in Latin about their thoughts on humanism and Christianity. The important point here is that they kept to the old Latin rather than writing in the newly emergent Italian language. The Italian language of Dante, Boccaccio and Plutarch was consciously avoided by the group. It is clear that Ficino wished his letters to be preserved and much of their content seems to be with one eye on publication. In a letter to his fellow philosophers in the group he referred to as the Academy he says:

“Let us climb into the high watchtower of the mind, leaving the dust of the body below; then we will gaze more closely at the divine and view the mortal from a distance”

This strikes me as being real “ivory tower” stuff and I could imagine Ficino and his cronies getting increasingly lost in their academic studies and having little relevance to renaissance life. Machiavelli writing twenty years later would prove to be much more in tune with the political will of the tyrants in power.

Ficino was ordained a priest and his continual struggle in attempting to reconcile the pagan with the Christian is evident in many of the letters. He was careful not to be taken for a heretic especially when addressing men of the cloth, however so many of his letters are steeped in pagan imagery that his struggle is self evident.

There are some fine and beautiful letters in this collection which have been translated by members of the Language Department of the School of Economic Science. Here is one that shows his humanist stance and is worth quoting in full:

“Why are boys more cruel than old men, madmen more cruel than the sane , stupid men more cruel than the clever? Because the former are, so to speak, less human than the others. Hence those that are more cruel are called inhuman and brutish. For those who fall far short of the full nature of Man, through lack of years, mental defect, physical disease, or an unfavourable position of the stars, mostly hate or ignore the human race as if it were something alien and unconnected to them. Nero was not a man, I would say but a monster in a man’s skin. For if he had really been a man, he would have loved all other men as members of the same body.

Individual men, formed by one idea in the same image, are one man. It is for this reason I think, that of all the virtues, wise men named only one after man himself: that is humanity, which loves and cares for all men as though they were brothers, born in a long succession of one father.

Therefore, most humane man, persevere in the service of humanity. Nothing is dearer to God than love. There is no surer sign of madness and of future misery than cruelty.

Remain a friend to Carlo Valguli of Brescia; for he is a man of outstanding humanity, as well as excelling in the humanities through his studies of Greek and Latin”

This book will not appeal to everybody and readers will gain more from it if they are familiar with the philosophy of Plato and the Neo-Platonists.

Isn't it ironic that the more the traditionalists (Latinists, in this case) want to be universally appreciated, the further they stray from the universal experience?

I love the quotes from the letters, Barry.

#18 but, does it make them irrelevant, or does it extend their relevance staying within the less mutable* ideal? I'm struck by Ficino's idealism in these excerpts.

*It scares me that I just used "mutable" in a sentence...

I think i'm very much with dan on this. Visionaries such as Ficino are of necessity in a different world to that experienced by most people - think Blake, Jung, Gurdjieff, even Einstein.... Sometimes they are talking nonsense, sometimes they are making leaps that bring us further along the road (not sure where the road is going, but anyway...)

zeno, and dan, I don't see Ficino as a visionary, he seems to me to be more on the back foot. A man who in some ways had been left behind by political and linguistic developments in Florence in the late 15th century. His group already showed signs of being anachronistic.

>21 zenomax:, 22

Also the word 'visionary' for me connotes someone steeped in mysticism or arcane spiritual practices. Take Blake's Marriage of Heaven and Hell or Jung's writings on esoteric spiritual traditions and analytical psychology (which I have not gotten to sadly, only his more mainstream works). Was Ficino interested in reviving Neo-Platonic practice or was he more of a scholar? Or does my question not make sense?

(Note to self: read up on Neo-Platonism.)

By the way baswood, the same thing you said on my reading journal: VERY interesting.

Hi lilbrattyteen,

I think Ficino was a scholar first and foremost. He spent most of his life translating Plato. However he could not help but be influenced by what he found there. I am not aware that he undertook any Neo Platonic practices if such things existed. He does not seem to have invented any.

The Renaissance in Italy is always portrayed as a time when humanist thought developed, it was a time when the catholic church seemed steeped in corruption and the absence of a feudal society and a relatively stable political situation allowed people to think outside of the religious constraints imposed by the church. It was the discovery of texts from antiquity and their translation that led these thoughts. The ironic thing of course was that most of the translations were carried out by churchmen and so the conflict with pagan thought had to be accommodated.

By the way I am no expert, this is just a view I have taken from my reading.

John Middleton Murray, Frieda Lawrence and D H Lawrence (without the beard)

Flame into Being: The Life and Work of D H Lawrence by Anthony Burgess
At just over 200 pages this is not an in-depth study of either Lawrence’s works or his life but it does serve as an introduction to both, although perhaps rather an idiosyncratic one. Burgess admired Lawrence’s ability to let the writing pour out of him; much of what he wrote he saw little need to edit or re-vamp. I think Burgess has attempted a similar approach with this book; it has the feel of being written down just as the thoughts come to him. This is not to say that Burgess has written a poor book, far from it, as it is clear he knows his subject well, is himself a writer of the first order and would have carried out plenty of research beforehand.

Burgess races through Lawrence’s life chronologically devoting time along the way to review his novels and other works as they occurred. Part of Lawrence’s genius was his intense observation of people and the natural world around him and his ability to express those observations in prose that captures the life of his subjects. Life flowed through him and onto his writing paper, wherever he happened to be and sparked his thinking and the creative process. While it is not essential or even desirable to have knowledge of the life of an author to appreciate his/her work, it is useful in Lawrence’s case because of the immediacy of his writing. Burgess reminds us of the trouble that Lawrence found himself in, because friends and acquaintances recognised themselves as characters in his novels. He drew down from life in a way that was at times quite reckless.

Burgess is an admirer of Lawrence and it is quite clear to him that “Women in Love” is one of the top ten novels of the 20th century, however this does not lead him to write a panegyric about this or any other of his novels. Burgess uses his critical facilities to point out the issues that the novels raise and there are always issues with Lawrence. Of Women in Love he reminds us that Lawrence was deep into the psychology of his characters without being impressed with psychoanalytical theory which was burgeoning at the time. Burgess says of Lawrence:

“The artist is alone with his intuitions and, as always with this artist, takes terrible chances.”

Surely that is the essence of why Lawrence is still such an exciting read today. We do not need to agree with his conclusions but we can admire the powers of his observations and the poetry in nearly everything he wrote.

Burgess cannot help but be emotionally involved with his subject. When writing about Lawrence’s poetry he says after copying out some lines; “I have had difficulty in copying out those lines, because of the tears” and again at the end of the chapter when Burgess must deal with the Lawrence’s privations during the first world war “What comes next is very painful to write”. These interjections while provoking an emotional response also help the reader to feel that they are ‘in the moment’ with Burgess as he writes his book.

The reader is never in any doubt that this is first and foremost a celebrated author’s view on one of the greats of English Literature. We are always aware that this is Anthony Burgess writing the book and that his views come from a wide experience of reading and writing. My impressions are that Burgess does not have anything startlingly original to say, but some of his ruminations hit the target and provoke some thought. Burgess makes a plea to rank “Kangaroo” (the Australian novel Lawrence wrote in little over 5 weeks) high in the canon, while dismissing novels like Aaron’s Rod as mere pot boilers. These are views that may raise eyebrows, but are not going to provoke heated discussions. A fine closing chapter looks back on the oeuvre as a whole and asks the question “What would Lawrence have gone on to write had he not succumbed to tuberculosis at 44 years old? .

I enjoyed this book which is written with verve and panache. Lawrence and his work come alive, both for the experienced Lawrence observer and I think for those people who want a fairly quick introduction to the world of D H Lawrence. There is no index and a very short Bibliography.

Great review of Flame into Being: The Life and Work of D H Lawrence, Barry. It sounds like exactly the introduction to Lawrence that I need.

Having recently read Burgess's biographical novels about Shakespeare and Marlowe, I'm not surprised that he should be emotionally engaged with his subject as a biographer. I agree with Linda that this sounds like a great starting point.

Love the picture -- Burgess is always an interesting reviewer and bio-commentator.

Having not read Lawrence or Burgess, I can't really comment, but enjoyed your review.

Glad you also enjoyed Burgess's treatment of Lawrence, Barry. Thumbed.

Dewald, reading your excellent review of Flame into Being along with a re-read of Lady C got me back into D H Lawrence. I should not have stayed away so long.

Steven, Linda, yes Anthony Burgess is a good introduction to Lawrence, particularly on his life story. The reviews of the novels however may be a little puzzling if you have not read them and the extracts from them make Lawrence sound more difficult than he actually is.

22 interesting analysis of Ficino as anachronism, bas. I'll have to take that on board when I get around to him.

Hypnerotomachia Poliphili

Hypnerotomachia Poliphili: The Strife of Love In a Dream Translated by Joscelyn Godwin
Described on the back cover as a strange, pagan, erotic, allegorical, mythological romance and I would add at times a tedious, difficult, but also a fascinating read for anybody interested in medieval or renaissance literature. Written in the later part of the 15th century probably by the ordained priest Francesco Colonna; it was published in Venice in 1499. One of the earliest printed books it proved to be quite an undertaking to get it set for printing with its many wood cut pictures and diagrams, its mixture of Greek, Latin and made up text in the vernacular and it’s layout on the page, which predates some of the ‘concrete’ poetry of later times.

The simple love story beneath all the allegory, dream imagery and technical details is about Poliphil’s love for Polia a nun living under strict religious orders following her survival of a plague epidemic. In Poliphil’s dream he is in a strange land where he must undergo certain trials in his search for Polia. The allegory has him escaping from the perils of the forest where his earlier life was spent and after petitioning the Gods he places himself in the hands of the five senses who lead him to freewill. He then travels with two nymphs (reason and inclination) to an abode with three doors. The doors lead to a world of religion, ambition or love and beauty and Poliphil chooses love and beauty at which point he is deserted by the nymph of reason. His journey continues and he is accompanied by a maiden carrying a torch who appears to be Polia. They reach the domain of Venus Physizoe and in the temple of Venus various rites and initiations are performed before the nymph drops her torch and becomes Polia. They journey on through a desolate city of tombs where they witness the pangs of souls tormented by crimes against love, here the book feels like something lifted from Dante’s inferno. They eventually reach a large stretch of water and Cupid’s barge approaches, they climb aboard and are taken to the island of Cythera; a magical place of gardens, groves and labyrinths. Here near the tomb of Adonis the two lovers settle down and Polia tells her side of the love story to the nymphs that surround them. Polia’s story is told in the much shorter second part of the book and it is shorn of much of the allegory of the first part and tells simply how she is wooed by Poliphil. This is a more realistic and dramatic telling of the love story and takes place in the real world, however the telling of the story ends with Poliphil waking up from his dream and regretting that he cannot recapture it.

The Hypnerotomachia Poliphili is a curious mix indeed, it seems to defy interpretation and also resists attempts to pin it down as wholly a work of the renaissance, this is because it contains so many elements of medieval writing and thought. It singularly avoids anything relating to Christianity with its subject matter being the intervention of pagan gods and its reverence for antiquity placing it firmly in the humanist tradition of the Italian renaissance. The structure of the book centered round the idea of a dream vision and its encyclopedic treatment of plants, animals, buildings and gardens harkens back to medieval times. Francesco Colonna appears to be standing at the crossroads between two periods, but perhaps it was never as clear cut as that and the Hypnerotomachia would have not seemed so out of place to readers in the early 16th century.

I mentioned earlier that the book can be a tedious read and that is because Colonna goes into the minutest detail when describing the gardens or buildings that Poliphil comes across on his journey. I found myself scanning whole sections where I soon became lost in the architectural detail. I have trouble enough in relating two dimensions into three and I am reliably informed that much of the structural detail contained in the writing would simply not work and so I soon found myself giving up on the attempt., however there are many line (woodcut) drawings to help with the visualisation and even if they are difficult to relate to at least they break up the text on the page. I got the impression that the technical details were in many ways more important than the love story, they seemed to be a celebration of renaissance learning that had been scrupulously adapted from antiquity. The love story seems to be buried in the detail, which can be frustrating for modern readers. This is certainly the case with the longer part I. In part II we are back to some sort of reality, but it is more inclined towards the reality of courtly love with Polyphil acting out all the precepts of the lover frustrated by not being able to attain his heart’s desires. The underlying story just about held my attention with the anticipation of what would happen next.

I did not find all the descriptions tedious as Colonna was obviously using his own experience when describing the processions that were a feature of Renaissance city life and his imagination does not let him down when describing cupid’s barge or the scantily clad nymphs that accompanied him. Some of these descriptions have an erotic charge, which seems a little out of place for a priestly author; but then again perhaps not. Some examples of the nymphs on the island of Cythera:

“Others covered there breasts with silken garments - breasts whiter than wintry frosts of Capricorn and pleasingly adorned with the first swelling of their bold nipples, resembling high-breasted apples with semi-globes standing out from them……; and yet others were cloaked in thin cotton that veiled their beautiful bellies and clung sportively to them…..Aschemosyne, presented herself amongst all these clothed nymphs fearlessly naked and provocative, just as though she had drunk of the Salmacian spring. In her left hand she held by its centre a sphere made from gold plates, and with her right she seductively prevented her long hair from covering her plump and wriggling buttocks. She was in a truly wanton condition, making obscene tribadic motions and rolling her eyes. With her prurient actions she resembled some shameless Gaditanian, crudely gesturing with excessive lust. The filthy Hostius, watching sodomites in concave mirrors was no worse than she.”

I enjoyed the translation by Joscelyn Godwin, which could not have been an easy one to do as Colonne had a penchant for making up his own words. Godwin has produced a text that flows smoothly most of the time with no “too modern” intrusions. There are many allusions to classical literature, but these are encompassed in the text in such a way that there is no need to look further to find their relevance. It takes some perseverance to plough through what appears to be so much superfluous detail in part I and yet this part has the dream like quality that is promised by the title of the book. I am glad I read it, but then again I am finding this period of history and its literature absolutely fascinating and so I guess it would not appeal to the more casual reader.

You are really giving me an education in medieval and renaissance literature -- thank you!

The Poliphili book sounds like a Jungian analyst's dream. It's on my TBR list.

As soon as I got to the quote about "wriggling buttocks" this book went straight to my wishlist. It's one I had never heard of before (often the case with your reading). I see there's a version free on Project Gutenberg, bit it's a translation from 1592 in the original spelling.

I recently came across a copy of the Dialogues of Pietro Aretino. Is he on your reading list?

steven, I would avoid the original spelling version it would be incomprehensible. The book is hard enough to get through with all the architectural stuff.

Good old Pietro Aretino wrote some racy stuff. I have got a copy of The secret life of Nuns quick quote: "My dear Antonio, nuns, married women and whores are like crossroads: the minute you come up to one, you spend ages wondering which way to turn" I should get to this next month. Thanks for the heads up on The dialogues of Pietro Aretino, I will search out a copy of this.

Barry, The Secret Life of Nuns is actually part of the work published as Aretino's Dialogues. There are six dialogues in all. The first three are The Secret Life of Nuns, The Secret Life of Wives, and "The Secret Life of Whores." The final three dialogues are instructions in becoming a courtesan, all or part of which have been published in extract as The School of Whoredom.

Thanks for that steven. I will start off with The secret life of Nuns and then decide if I want to read anymore.

A PROPOS OF LADY CHATTERLEY'S LOVER - and Other Essays by D. H. (introduction by Mark Shorer) Lawrence
“The result of taboo is insanity. And insanity, especially mob insanity, is the fearful danger that threatens our civilization. There are certain persons with a sort of rabies, who live only to infect the mass. If the young do not watch out, they will find themselves, before so very many years are past, engulfed in a howling manifestation of mob-insanity, truly terrifying to think of……………We shall have to fight the mob, in order to keep sane, and to keep society sane.”

D H Lawrence wrote this as a closing paragraph to his introduction of ‘Pansies’ (a collection of poetry) in 1929. He has since been labelled a prophet and this paragraph could be interpreted as a prediction of the rise of the Nazis. A little far fetched I think as earlier on in his essay Lawrence had been talking about taboos in connection with what was considered obscene. This short collection of essays written near the end of his life is concerned very much with obscenity and pornography. Lady Chatterley's Lover his last novel could not be published in England or America and the police had recently raided an exhibition of his paintings and taken several away with a view to prosecution, however although this was very much in Lawrence’s mind these final essays range far and wide and are a continual delight: full of interest, of passion and of humour.

His essay “Introduction to His Paintings” also written in 1929 starts with him asserting that the fear of syphilis gave a fearful blow to sexual life. This fear and horror is reflected in much art, particularly in English painting, which has a fear of the human body. The English, he says; are good at landscapes, but when they get to the human form they wrap it up in so much clothing it becomes almost invisible. He detects a hatred of the human form brought about by an unconscious fear of syphilis. This leads him on to talk about morality and the insistence by the ruling classes that man is basically wicked, which had the effect of the great and the good enslaving the common man to industry, He says:

“the good got hold of the goods, and our modern ‘civilization’ of money machines and wage-slaves was inaugurated. The very pivot of it, let us never forget, being fear and hate, the most intimate fear and hate, fear and hate of one’s own instinctive, intuitive body, and fear and hate of every other man’s and every other woman’s warm, procreative body and imagination.”

Lawrence then launches into a critique of European painters who tackled the human form; none to Mr Lawrence’s satisfaction until he gets to Cezanne, where he talks about the artists battle with the cliché and his attempts to go further than seeking the perfect form which seems so important to art critics. This leads him back to a discussion about the future of English painting, but he is not very hopeful.

“The law is a dreary thing and its judgements have nothing to do with life”

Says Lawrence near the start of his essay on Pornography and Obscenity,.he goes on to try and define pornography and concludes by saying that “you can recognise it by the insult it offers, invariably to sex, and to the human spirit” He opines that sex had become a ‘dirty little secret’ a view that seems to encapsulate Victorian Britain’s attitude to sex. The way to get out from under this attitude is simply to do away with the secret. No more secrecy he thunders and then discusses modern attitudes to sex. He has a rant about the dangers of masturbation, not so much physical dangers as a mental burden that serves to check the flow of life. If the attitude of the dirty little secret prevails then Lawrence believes that the public will be in a state of general idiocy. It is the general public that is responsible for public opinion and Lawrence describes how the dainty police removed all the pictures from his exhibition that showed a fragment of human pudenda. This was the test for obscenity.

The final essay by Lawrence “A Propos of Lady Chatterley’s Lover, early on states that:

“And this is the real point of the book. I want men and women to be able to think sex, fully, completely, honestly, and cleanly” ………..and later; “Far be it from me to suggest that all women should go running after gamekeepers for lovers”

Their follows a vigorous defence of the institution of marriage, but a marriage freely entered into where the partner’s sex life is compatible. He says marriage is the clue to human life, but it must be in tune with the wheeling sun and the nodding earth. Lawrence is aiming no less than for a marriage that is in tune with nature and the cosmos. There is much insight here along with some typical Lawrentian themes that take the reader into his realms of blood consciousness, but Lawrence here is in control and much of his wilder notions are reigned in. He gets back to talking about the book itself and whether Clifford Chatterley's paralysis and impotency is symbolic. He reveals that the story just came to him as it did and he left it alone. There is also a discussion about the difficulties he had of getting it printed and the pirate versions that appeared at the time.

This is a very good essay and will be of interest to all readers of Lady Chatterley’s lover and Lawrence finishes with a little joke against himself:

“Well one of them was a brainy vamp, and the other was a sexual moron, said an American woman, referring to the two men in the book - so I am afraid that Connie (Lady Chatterley) had a poor choice - as usual.”.

T S Eliot the influential author and critic claimed that Lawrence had no sense of humour. There is much evidence to the contrary in these essays that sparkle with wit and life, even more remarkable when one is made aware that they were written by a man dying of tuberculosis.

My penguin edition of these essays finishes with an essay by Mark Schorer titled Introduction to Lady Chatterley’s Lover. This takes up 30 pages of the total of 160 and so you don’t get a full measure of D H Lawrence. The Schorer essay is good enough, but pales into insignificance when compared to those written by Lawrence, perhaps that was the point of including it.

Wonderful stuff on H P.

That amusing comment raises the issue of female pragmatism and its incompatibility with a true appreciation of D. H. Lawrence. However, I am planning to read Kangaroo, which is available as a free ebook, in order to give Lawrence another try.

Interesting review, Barry. I think I'd rather read Lawrence's novels than his opinions.

Excellent review on the Lawrence essays, Barry. His candor and humanism remind me of Montaigne. This goes on the wishlist, though I still have much more of Lawrence's fiction to read too.

Great review of the Lawrence essays, Barry. I must pick this one up. Have you read his Studies in Classic American Literature or Mornings in Mexico and Etruscan Places? They're quite wonderful too.

Ah pamelad Kangaroo The great Australian novel written in 5 and a half weeks while Lawrence was visiting Australia - enjoy.

I am really enjoying re-visiting Lawrence and have yet to read Studies in Classic American literature. Yes jane Mornings in Mexico and Etruscan Places is quite wonderful. He was a great travel writer.

Fantastic review of Hypnerotomachia Poliphili. I've wanted to read that for awhile now and appreciated your detailed description.

Also enjoying your reviews of your Lawrence reading.

#43 - missed these Lawrence musings when I posted in #44. Very interesting stuff, no clue how to respond to them though.

On Moral Fiction by John Gardner
“We need to stop excusing mediocre and downright pernicious art, stop ‘taking it for what it’s worth’ as we take our fast foods, our overpriced cars that are no good, the overpriced houses we spend all our lives fixing, out television programs, our schools thrown up like barricades in the way of young minds, our brainless fat religions, our poisonous air, our incredible cult of sports, and our ritual with fornicating with all pretty or even horse-faced strangers.”

So thunders John Gardner, who had had more than enough of modern American Art; especially literature, in the 1970’s. What he would have made of a best seller like Fifty Shades of Grey in 2012 is anybody’s guess. He might well have said, but that’s pulp fiction, but I still think he would struggle to recognise anything much written today that he would consider Literature.

John Gardner’s wide ranging book of criticism bemoans that the art of the modern era is a failure of morals. He would like to see a move back to more traditional views where true art is moral; in that it seeks to improve life rather than debase it. He sees art as essentially serious and beneficial in that its serves to protect us from chaos and entropy. Art is necessary for our humanness and should be rediscovered and refined generation by generation and it is criticism’s job to reinforce this process. The art of his era (mid 1970’s) he claims has taken a wrong turn. It is far more concerned with fitting into the latest ism or fashion rather than addressing the major life giving themes. It has become trivialised. He says he is more qualified to talk about fiction, but can see the same issues in other forms of art. He thinks the role of art in a democratic society; should be primarily to instruct, to make clear, to provide alternatives, to enable people to understand the issues facing them, it should help to break down barriers and hold up ideals worth pursuing. It should not be spending most of it’s time sneering and snarling and wrapping itself up in self-defeating cynicism. He says that technically, current American novelist are good enough and shrewd enough and with the help of publishers and reviewers produce work that is much the same: commercially slick, full of misplaced cleverness, posturing and wild floundering, Intelligent readers ask themselves if any first rate American authors still exist, while critics are not slow in coming forward with the next great thing, but as Gardner says: “Never judge the age of the horse by the smile of the farmer”

By chapter five Gardner is ready to name names. He picks out three authors widely praised who he thinks could do a whole lot better; Norman Mailer, Kurt Vonnegut Jnr and Joseph Heller. In each case Gardner finds them sacrificing their creative writing in an
Attempt to deliver a message. The characters in the novels do not take on a life of their own, they are not developed they are just there to aid the author with his clever tricks, his cynical; manoeuvrings and usually dire solutions. In Gardner’s view characters should serve the author with the means to carry out open minded exploration of what he can honestly say, in this way themes and ideas are developed that can take the novel in new and unexpected directions. Saul Bellow and John Barth also come in for some criticism before Gardner asks how many of the so called important artists; Thomas Pynchon, Joyce Carol Oates, Robert Coover, Donald Barthelme, James Purdy, William Gaddis, John Hawkes, Katherine Anne Porter, Guy Davenport, John Cheever, Bernard Malamud, J D Salinger, Eudora Welty and John Updike; How many of them will outlast the century?

So to part II which Gardner calls Principles of Art and Criticism. Generally I found this part less interesting than part I. Gardner starts off well enough by making a plea that bad art should be revealed for what it is – bad, however this leads him on to discuss what he means by bad art and then inevitably onto the age old question of What is art? While I found his ideas thoughtful and lively they did not really lead him anywhere. This section felt like what it probably was: a series of lecture notes that had been adapted to fit into his book.In fact towards the end of this section we are in the realms of poetry appreciation, all good stuff but it feels shoe-horned in

I like John Gardner’s intelligence and enthusiasm for his subject. He writes well and seems to take the reader into his confidence, almost as if he expects you to agree with him, however if you do not agree with his view that the literature of today (late 1970’s) does not compare with literature of the past, then you probably won’t like his book. I found it entertaining and well argued, but although it gives plenty of food for thought, it is a fairly narrow viewpoint and so 3.5 stars.

Nice review of On Moral Fiction. He picks out three authors widely praised who he thinks could do a whole lot better; Norman Mailer, Kurt Vonnegut Jnr and Joseph Heller. Once I asked a friend of mine if he had ever read Joseph Heller's Catch 22 and he said, "It's the only book I've ever thrown across the room." Maybe he would enjoy On Moral Fiction.

Too bad he missed out on Toni Morrison.

>54 janeajones: Still laughing, although I have to confess to liking Norman Mailer, even though he could have done better.

Fascinating review of the Gardner. I do have a feeling, though, that anyone, at any time, could make a similar complaint about popular fiction versus serious literature. The popular stuff mostly doesn't survive, so we think all those old-timey people just wrote and read great literature, but there's always been popular entertainment as long as we humans have existed. There could well be more of it now, because we have the technology to produce and distribute whatever people want to write, but I don't know that that means there's less serious fiction, just that it's harder to find.

And, that said, let's hear it for entertainment, well done!

I don't think it is a co-incidence that the writers who "could do better" were, at the time, Gardner's main literary rivals. Every time a writer produces a manifesto on literature it tends to say 'my books are real literature; these other writers don't really understand what is truly important'.

If anyone has failed to last to the end of the century it has been Gardner; his fiction, with the exception of Grendel, has almost disappeared, which is a pity, a novel like The Sunlight Dialogues is up there with the best.

So thunders John Gardner
By chapter five Gardner is ready to name names

Riveting review! I'm enamored of Gardner's instruction/influence and this grounds me before getting into The Art of Fiction.

What bothers me about Gardner's stance is that it's easy to criticize a work of (supposed?) art as mediocre, but rather difficult to create something that isn't. Wondering what Gardner's examples of good art are.

>59 dchaikin: - I have a book by Gardner called On Writers and Writing which almost seems a companion piece to On Moral Fiction. It contains a few essays and reviews so we get positive feedback on Italo Calvino (The Castle of Crossed Destinies), Joyce Carol Oates (Bellefleur), and John Cheever (Falconer & The Stories of John Cheever). Surprisingly he also has good words for The Lord of the Rings.

Hi Turner and Dan, On the subject of John Gardner

The absolute greats from the past according to John Gardner are: Homer, Aeschylus, Sophocles, and Euripides; Virgil's Aeneid, Dante's Commedia; Chaucer, the plays of Shakespeare and Racine; the novels of Tolstoy, Melville, Thommas Mann and James Joyce.

He has good things to say about Itallo Calvino, John Cheever and Joyce Carol Oates as Turner points out. He is very positive about John Fowles and Donald Barthelme and thinks that Bernard Malamud, Guy Davenport and Eudora Welty have the best chance to develop further. He is ambivalent about John Updike and Saul Bellow.

He reckons that; Katherine Anne Porter, Robert Coover and William Gaddis will be lost because of sheer meanness and that Thomas Pynchon and John Barth will be lost through intellectual blight, academic meanness or fakery.

Interestingly he thinks that the 1970's were adversely affected by debilitating guilt caused by:
1) The determinism of Freud
2) The pessimism of Sartre
3) The logical and linguistic cautiousness of Wittgenstein.

I am intrigued Turner by your recommendation for The Sunlight Dialogues. I might search this one out.

detailmuse, yes I am also fascinated by John Gardner I loved Grendel and thought his The life and Times of Chaucer was also very good.

avidmom I am a big fan of Catch 22 one of the funniest books I have ever read.

SassyLassy yes a lot of people could have done better according to Gardner. He does not like modern music much either and is particularly withering about John Cage.

rebecca, yes indeed it is difficult to find serious fiction amongst all the stuff that is published today, and it will be the test of time that will decide what was great.

jane, I don't know how he missed Toni Morrison.

I think he may have missed Morrison simply by the fact she wasn't much on the radar in the late 70s. Her third novel only came out in 1977 and she didn't have the reputation she does now, that all goes back to Beloved, which increased her profile exponentially.

Heller did seem more interested in style and structure over characterization, to the point of it being his "signature." I understand wanting to throw Catch-22 across the room, the structure makes parts incomprehensible. But I agree it’s hilarious, and also heartbreaking. I also enjoyed his Something Happened -- boring instead of incomprehensible (aka: “NOTHING Happened”), amusing and melancholic.

I’ve been craving another Heller satire this summer but it looks like I’ll get to Sinclair Lewis’s Babbitt instead. And eager to get to Gardner.

Catch-22 is one of my favourite books. I re-read it every so often when the politics at work are driving me nuts, and it puts things back in perspective. Barry, your summary of On moral Fiction seems to suggest that Gardner believes that art should be insulated from reality, a premise with which I would strongly disagree.

It's been so long since I read it but I do remember liking Catch 22; apparently my friend did not. I had to read Catch 22 for a college course, we watched the film too. Now, parts of that I still remember... mainly the hospital scene.

pamelad, no I do not think that Gardner believes that art should be insulated from reality, but he does think it should do much more than just being real. Great art should tackle universal truths; it should have some effect on people. I suppose he is saying it ought to transcend reality.

#60/61 Turner & Bas - Thanks for the response. Just a thought...the 1970's equivalent of Melville hasn't been re-discovered yet.

I've read two of his books, and I can confidently say that I despise John Gardner. He is the quintessential pompous ass with a significant ego-disorder.

Gardner asks how many of the so called important artists; Thomas Pynchon, Joyce Carol Oates, Robert Coover, Donald Barthelme, James Purdy, William Gaddis, John Hawkes, Katherine Anne Porter, Guy Davenport, John Cheever, Bernard Malamud, J D Salinger, Eudora Welty and John Updike; How many of them will outlast the century?

So? Why is that important? If a book speaks to me and is enjoyable and intellectually stimulating, etc and so on, does it have less value if my great-grandchildren don't appreciate it? That is not a concern of mine. Some critics of 1001 Books You Must Read Before You Die (which I dabble with only because it's FUN) complain that too many books on the list--say, Cloud Atlas or The Human Stain (to pick any two from the list) --shouldn't be there because a hundred years from now we'll still be reading Don Quixote and Madame Bovary, but not those. Who cares?

Sorry, Gardner makes me want to lean over and poke him in the eye with my finger. Okay, grumpily returning to lurk mode now.

You are not his biggest fan then Joyce.

Interesting points though. Are we all getting too precious about what is great art? Does it matter?
It seemed to matter to John Gardner.

Lucrezia Borgia

Lucrezia Borgia, Maria Bellonci
The Borgia's have been vilified in popular history as abusers of power, murderers and worse during the renaissance in Italy, perhaps the only one of the family that did not commit murder was Lucrezia, but her name has been inextricably linked with poison although there is no evidence linking her with any such deed. It is interesting that Lucrezia has become the most infamous of the Borgias, when it would seem from Maria Bellonci’s biography that she was very much a victim of the machinations of her family.

Maria Bellonci’s biography was published in 1939 and translated into English in 1953. It very much sets itself to put the record straight. Bellonci was at pains to point out the amount of research into original documents that she carried out and although there are no details of her researches in the bibliography, she refers to them in her text especially when she challenges one of the more spurious myths that have grown up around her subject. Make no mistake this is a biography aimed at the general reader, but it has a feeling of authenticity about it, that plunges the reader into the life and times of the Borgia family.

Lucrezia remains the main subject of the book, but her father Roderigo Borgia,who became Pope Alexander VI and her brother Cesare Borgia loom large. Lucrezia’s fortunes were so closely linked with her family that it could not be otherwise. Roderigo Borgia was typical of many of the men who managed to get themselves elected as Pope during the renaissance. Their driving force was their personal ambition and desire to increase the fortunes of their family. Unlike other tyrants that ruled the city states around them in Italy at the time there was no possibility of them passing on the Papacy to their children and so the only way to achieve their ambitions was to carve out territory or dependencies for themselves or to marry off their children advantageously to noble or even royal families. Lucrezia a beautiful and accomplished young women in her own right was therefore seen as a major investment to achieve those ends and much time and energy was spent in arranging the best marriage for her. Alexander VI is portrayed as a ruthless seeker of power, but the dichotomy was his love for his family. There was therefore a continual tension between his need to use his children for the good of the family and his prestige, and his undoubted affection for them as individuals. Bellonci makes no excuses for the actions of the Borgia family, but she does put them in the context of the times in which they lived.

Alexander VI worked hard to get Lucrezia’s first marriage annulled, because there were better prospects as the power of the Papacy increased and the need to ally themselves with the Neapolitans. Lucrezia’s second marriage was to Alfonso of Aragon Duke of Bisceglie. This proved to be short lived owing to the murder of Alfonso for political reasons. Bellonci describes the events in some detail because it was on Cesare Borgia’s orders that Alfonso was murdered and certainly Lucrezia was very much involved, because she was ostensibly trying to protect her husband after a first abortive attack on him. Bellonci’s reading of the chronicles at the time leads her to believe that Lucrezia was not party to the murder, but was tricked by her bothers accomplices. Clearly Alfonso’s murder benefited the Borgias who were seeking to ally themselves with the French, rather than the Spanish influence in the court of Naples. Lucrezia was free to marry again and her final marriage was to Alfonso of Este, Duke of Ferrara. This marriage freed Lucrezia to some extent from the Borgia families influence but the family that she married into were hardly any different from the Borgia's, with intrigue and murder being not unusual.

Lucrezia Borgia emerges as very much a woman of her times, no better or worse than many women of noble birth. Her life to a large extent was controlled by the powerful men in her family, but she was also a competent person in her own right, able and willing to take on the affairs of the state in her fathers and husbands absences. She was able to indulge in her own love affairs and proved to be as adept in these intrigues as the men around her in theirs. She was certainly a victim of the times in which she lived (she died after giving birth to her eight child) and this is the overwhelming portrait that Bellonci presents to us.

Lucrezia Borgia’s life and turbulent times has enough incidents to make an exciting story in it’s own right and Bellonci tells her story very well. It is the background material, the descriptions of the pageantry, the fabulous clothes and jewellery, the trappings of power, that could only have come from researches into the chronicles of the times that lift this biography out of the ordinary. The book seems to drip with renaissance life; albeit the life of the powerful and the privileged. The historical background, which is essential to the story is integrated well within it and I found it an absorbing read. This is perhaps not the last word on Lucrezia Borgia as I suspect that Bellonci may be accused of believing too much in the sources at her disposal and there will have been further researches and opinions since it was published in 1939, however it will do for me. As a portrait of a life in renaissance Italy, I think it would be hard to beat and therefore a recommended read.

Very interesting book. Does the author trace any reasons why Borgia has gotten a bad rap by historians?

Fascinating review.

lilbrattyteen, no not really, only that the family Borgia were one of the most acquisitive families of the renaissance, which was quite something with all the acquisitiveness that was going on at the time. Also of course they were Spanish and so were a natural target for the Italian chroniclers who would have shaped a national response to them.

The yearly bookswop today in this corner of South West France. There were over 4,500 books up for grabs.

As the young woman next to me slipped a pile of books into her carrier bag she said "this is wonderful, it feels just like stealing books from W H Smiths."

I came away with 68 books

Wow! I'm speechless in awe!

Some of those books that I got at the swop were:

Solar, Ian McEwan
Bel canto Ann Patchett
An Experiment in Love Hilary Mantel
The Dream Life of Sukhanov, Olga Grushin
The Story of the Night Colm Toibin
The Cry of the Owl, Patricia Highsmith
The Savage Detectives, Roberto Bolano
What's Bred in the Bone Robertson Davies
The Cunning Man Robertson Davies
Oranges are not the Only Fruit, Jeanette Winterson
Cannery Row, John Steinbeck
More than Human Theodore Sturgeon
The Sound and the Fury William Faulkner
Beloved, Toni Morrison
The Malayan Trilogy, Anthony Burgess
The Stories of John Cheever, John Cheever
The Master of Ballantrea, The Black Arrow Robert Louis Stevenson
Three Restoration Comedies
Ivanhoe Sir Walter Scott
Bleak House, Charles Dickens
Victory Joseph Conrad
Wodwo, Ted Hughes
Poetry of the Forties
Grinning Jack; Selected Poems Brian Patten
Anna Karenina Leo Tolstoy
The Beautiful and Damned F Scott Fitzgerald
The Golden Bowl Henry James
Doctor Faustus, Thomas Mann
Marco Polo; The Travels
The Go-Between, L P Hartley
The Awkward Age, Henry James
The Marquise of O & Other Stories, Kleist
Effi Briest, Theodor Fontane
The Small House at Allington Anthony Trollope
Wuthering Heights, Emily Bronte
The Blessing, nancy Mitford
Tess of the D'Urbervilles, Thomas Hardy
The Charterhouse of Parma, Stendhal

What an incredible haul. Congrats; you have some excellent reading ahead.

68 books??? You'll have to build another bookshelf!

>68 dchaikin: WOW!

> 78

I'm almost glad I don't know of any of those where I live; too dangerous!

What a great idea. Who organises it?

Great discussion of Gardner's criticism, Barry, and an excellent review of Lucrezia Borgia.

Your book acquisitions are nearly double mine and include some very interesting titles. Great reading ahead! We did both pick up the same one by Hilary Mantel, which is one of hers that I had not previously heard of.

That's quite a windfall, Barry. I hadn't heard of this type of event before, but I assume you gave up at least 68 books you'd read to get 68 from other people, right? And you found all these books in English at an event in France?

Everything I recall reading about Lucrezia Borgia echos the sentiment that she managed to be both a loving wife to the men she was told to marry and a dutiful daughter and sister to the men who subsequently murdered her husbands and had her marry someone else.

The Bookswop is a very simple idea:

Find someone with a house or garden big enough to host the event and to store the books. This person then acts as a depository throughout the year for people who wish to swop books. In practice of course this means that three weeks before the great event, interested people need to be e mailed with the date of the bookswop so they can get their books to the hosts house in time for him to set them out on the bookswop day. If your bookswop host is flexible enough he will even accept books brought on the day. It is a free for all on bookswop day with people being allowed to take away as many books as they want, because there always seems to be more books donated than taken away.

Our host provides wine and good vibes, working like a trojan to keep the racks of books filled with the late arrivals. What can be better than browsing over books with a glass of wine to hand.

As in most regions in France there is a sizeable English speaking community and very few English book outlets available. The bookswop has been running for over ten years in our area and seems to get bigger every year.

Wow! I think that's the biggest book haul I've ever seen on LT.

That's fabulous, both the haul and the idea! I'm envious.

#86 - paradise...

#72 - fascinating info - medieval/renaissance murder for love...well, that and power.

omg your haul!!
And wine to browse by! Reminds me of one of my favorite bookstores, The Book Cellar.

The Alliterative Morte Arthure, The owl and the Nightingale and five other Middle English Poems by John Gardner.
The portrayal of an acquisitive King Arthur whose pride fuels his conquest of most of Europe is quite different from most other versions of the legend. His once noble deeds become those of a tyrant who forgets that fortunes wheel is always turning and in the medieval view of the world those that are at the top of the turn of the wheel and enjoy the greatest fortune must always be prepared for the downturn. Arthur's pride leads him to forget this fact and his final battle with his son Mordred leaves his kingdom in ruins and him in need of a confessor.

John Gardner’s modern translation of the alliterative Morte Arthure (aMA) works wonderfully well. He explains in a short preface his concern was to keep in tact the alliteration and metre of the poem and so some liberties have been taken with meaning and a few out of date words have been included because they fit so well. The poem reads so beautifully that I was prepared to go along with Gardner’s modus operandi. Here is an example as the Knights of the Round Table chase the fleeing Romans:

“There might men see chieftains on chalk-white steeds
Chop down on that chase the noblest of the chivalry;
The richest and most royal kings of Rome
Fell broken by hard steel, their ribs asunder,
Brains smashed in within their burnished helmets,
Overthrown by swords that flashed all the breadth of that land.
They hewed down heathen men with their hilted swords
By whole hundreds in a heap by the hem of the holtwood.
No silver could save their lives or succor them
Not sultan, Saracen, or senator of Rome.”

This poem of 4345 lines is thought to have been composed in about 1400 and was used by Sir Thomas Mallory as a source for sections of his epic Morte D’Arthure. The aMA contains only excerpts from what has become the Arthurian legends. It starts with Arthur at the height of his powers; he rules most of Europe and is celebrating New Year with the knights of the round table when emissaries of Lucius (Roman Emperor) appear before them to challenge Arthur. He sends them back to Rome with a flea in their ear and immediately sets in motion an expedition to overthrow Lucius. Over half the poem is taken up by this story and with Arthur's forces in Europe there are side tales of Sir Gawain's siege of Metz and Sir Cador’s expedition to Paris. Following the death of Lucius and with Arthur becoming increasingly more tyrannical there is a moment of pathos following the death of the “Good” Gawain before Arthur swears revenge and sets sail back to England where Mordred has married Guinevere and crowned himself king. The final section describes the battle with Mordred’s forces and the demise of the round table. This has been a very Christian telling of the legend and there is no pagan funeral to finish off the tale, instead we hear Arthurs’ last words:

“And afterward make your way to Mordred’s children,
And see them duly slain and slung to the waters,
And let no wicked weed wax mighty on earth;
I warn you for your honor do as I bid you!
And for God’s love in heaven, I give up my wrath
If Guinevere is well may peace be with her
He said on the land where he lay, ‘In manus tuas’,
And thus his spirit passed and he spoke no more.”

There is very little magic and mystery; no Merlin, no fantastic images and no Sir Lancelot, but Arthur has two dream visions that provide important reference points. The first is a battle between a dragon and a bear that is interpreted as Arthur (the dragon) defeating the tyrants in Europe. The second dream vision is Arthur’s dream about the wheel of fortune where he sees himself crushed to death beneath it. There is little need for interpretation of this, but the point is made that it is Arthur’s pride that is his undoing and he is reminded of the great men of history who have over reached themselves and have been done down in the end. The aMA has a richness that Malory’s version lacks: it’s descriptions of battles are more realistic, the story has a logical forward momentum and does not get bogged down in extraneous detail, Arthur himself moves from a heroic to a tragic figure in a way that is very convincing.

The alliterative Morte Arthur is not the only poem in Gardner’s book; he has brought to life a whole range of poems from the middle ages many of them in the alliterative tradition. None are as long or as impressive as aMA, but there is still much to delight the reader. Winner and Waster is a fine allegorical poem with some excellent lines and a fresh look into the psyche of the period. There is the gloomy “The debate of Body and Soul” and the wit and humour of “The owl and the Nightingale”. The short “Summer Sunday” with its wealth of alliteration also has its moments.

There is no doubt that the alliterative Morte Arthure is a fine poem in it’s own right and Gardner has produced a modern translation that make the lines sing. The inclusion of the other shorter poems from the late middle ages has given the book an added dimension as the reader is able to sense more of the variety of the literature that was being created at that time. Gardner has included 40 pages of commentary on the poems as well as notes on individual lines and so I think this book would also serve as a fine introduction to medieval literature and so 4.5 stars.

I was wondering what all the fuss was about this. Love these excerpts.

For the curious, here is second stanza that Bas posted in the "original"

And sythen merke manly to Mordrede children, 4320
That they bee sleyghely slayne and slongen in watyrs; 4321
Latt no wykkyde wede waxe, no wrythe one this erthe— 4322
I warne fore thy wirchipe, wirke alls I bydde. 4323
I foregyffe all greffe, for Cristez lufe of Heuen; 4324
Ȝife Waynour hafe wele wroghte, wele hir betydde." 4325
He saide In manus with mayne one molde whare he ligges, 4326
And thus passes his speryt, and spekes he no more. 4327

Thanks for that Dan, it is great to compare the two.

A very interesting work and an excellent review. This poem dates from around the same time as The Canterbury Tales, and the sample Dan posted looks very reminiscent of that work.

Bas - I'm always a sucker for King Arthur stuff. Sounds like Gardner did a great job - enjoyed your review that the verse you posted!

Films

The Angels' Share http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1924394/
A little gem of a film directed by Ken Loach that combines gritty realism with much humour and has that special cinematic quality of offering redemption to at least one of its characters.

Robbie; a Glaswegian thug narrowly escapes a prison sentence for violent assault. He is supported by his pregnant girlfriend and makes a number of new friends while doing his community service. The birth of his son inspires him to try and stay out of prison but there is a vendetta against him for past crimes. A newly discovered talent and a sympathetic community leader gives Robbie a chance to break out of the cycle of violence. A scam involving a whisky auction and his new friends enables Ken Loach to push the film towards comedy and there are some genuinely funny moments, but always with an edge of suspense. There is much swearing and the Glaswegian accents might prove difficult for some viewers. Well worth a night out at the cinema.

And on TV:

Ali http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0248667/
A biography of Muhammad Ali directed by Michael Mann. I enjoyed this much more than I thought I would. With a running time of 155 minutes it sounded way too long, but it held my attention throughout. Will Smith gives a creditable portrait of the great fighter and the director manages to give equal weight to the politics and the boxing. The climactic fight with George Foreman is well staged and Ali comes over as a strong willed character with an instinct for survival. A good film.

I am late stopping in, Barry, but loved your review of The Alliterative Morte Arthure, The owl and the Nightingale and five other Middle English Poems. With this, I am finally convinced that I need to visit the poetry of the middle ages, but with the help of Gardner's modern translation. Onto the wishlist it goes.

Thanks for the link to The Angels' Share. Being a fan of Glasgow, single malt whisky and Ken Loach, it sounds like a winner.

On a more serious note, I too loved your review of The Alliterative Morte Arthure. Is the d' missing because of the switch to medieval English?

SassyLassy, I can only assume that the missing d' is because of the switch to medieval English and the additional e at the end of Arthur.

The whisky tasting scenes in The Angel's Share were a torture to watch without a glass of the real stuff in front of me.

Riders in the Chariot by Patrick White
Phew! Patrick White’s long and complex novel takes some reading. It has a structure that invites the reader to compare and contrast the lives of the four main characters, all of whom are looking for redemption and are linked in some way with an idea or vision of the chariot in the sky, which may enable them to reach God or at least save their souls. White’s heavy use of religious symbolism; Christian, Jewish and Mystical attempts to bind their stories together, rather than through his characters physical interaction, although they are at least aware of each other and some understanding is shared. However I am not entirely convinced and his use of the more overt religious symbolism has resulted in a novel which I think is flawed and which no amount of brilliant writing (and there is plenty of this) can make into a truly great book. It is considered by some people to be his greatest achievement, but after my first reading I must disagree.

In 1961 after the success of his previous two novels Voss and The Tree of Man, White was an established author who would not have to worry about who would publish his next novel. He had arrived and typical of the man he thought his recognition had been too long in coming. Financially secure he could now devote all his energies on writing his next novel and it is not surprising that Riders in the Chariot should be his most ambitious work to date.

White sets his novel in a developing suburb of an Australian city shortly after the end of the second world war, but spends three quarters of his book filling in the back stories of his four riders in the chariot. He introduces them to us one by one starting with Mary Hare, who is considered to be a mad woman by many of the residents of Sarsaparilla. She lives in her own world in a folly of an enormous house named Xanadu, which is falling down around her. She may have been responsible for her father drowning in a cistern, but now finds herself under the malevolent influence of her house keeper Mrs Jolly. Mary is poorly educated but her natural insight into the natural world around her takes on a mystical aspect. She is able just to “know” certain things. She meets the next rider in the chariot; the old Jew Mordecai Himmelfarb in her orchard, who recognises a sort of kindred spirit. His story like the others is told in the omniscient third person and we learn of his life as an academic in Germany where he narrowly escaped the holocaust, but because of his own failure to act, could not save his wife whom he loved dearly. He now lives nearby working in the Brighta Bicycle Lamp factory punching holes in metal sheet as a sort of penance for his past failures and one suspects for his race and religious beliefs.

It is Ruth Godbold’s turn next who is now widowed with six daughters and takes in washing to scrape a living. Ruth was in service to a rich lady before falling in love with Tom Godbold a ladies man and general roughneck. Ruth’s failure in life is that her fierce Christian beliefs and her love were not enough to save her husband whom she was called upon to nurse through his final sickness brought on by indulgence and disease. Ruth’s Christian love for people worse off than herself leads her to nurse Mary Hare through a period of sickness and to look after the Jew Himmelfarb who lives nearby. The final character is Alf Dubbo an aboriginal half caste. Alf is taken in and raised by Mr Calderon an Anglican rector and his sister. Dubbo becomes fascinated with painting and drawing reaching ever deeper inside himself to express his feelings through his art. He allows himself to be seduced by Mr Calderon and when his sister discovers him in bed with the rector Dubbo is turned out. The rest of his life is lived on the edge of communities, he becomes ill with syphilis and finds some sort of community renting a room from a whore and her homosexual friend. Dubbo is finally employed sweeping the floors of the Brighta Bicycle Lamp factory (where Himmelfarb works); still trying to express his religious/mystic beliefs through the colours of his paintings.

The four characters have much in common; they are all living on the edges of society and are likely to be swept away by events, they all harbour feelings of guilt and struggle to find ways of redeeming themselves. They are all touched by God in some way and are searching for some spiritual awakening. They have all experienced the hostility and hatred of people around them and are more or less survivors, but only just. I might also add that they all let things happen to them, they do not take the initiative and appear weak and easily victimised They are of course all suffering and battling with the meanness of the people around them. White rarely has a good word to say about any of his peripheral characters and so the whole novel has a sense of the Author’s fundamental dissatisfaction with the human race.

Patrick White has created four marvellous characters whose thoughts and actions square superbly with the living histories he has given them. There are some superb passages of prose and White has never been better at writing around events in such a way that they can be open to re-interpretation. As readers we feel the madness of Miss Hare, the resignation of Himmelfarb and the diseased passion of Dubbo and the simple Christian goodness of Ruth Godbold.

The final quarter of the novel brings these characters into play and provides the events where the four riders in the chariot can glimpse their nemesis, but this is very much on an individual level. They do not interact with each other to any significant extent and Alf Dubbo seems to have wandered in from another novel to the extent that his refusal to act can only be expressed internally through his art.

The Book is prefaced with a quote from William Blake:

“The Prophets Isaiah and Ezekiel dined with me, and I asked them how they dared so roundly to assert that God spoke to them; and whether they did not think that at the time that they would be misunderstood. & so be the cause of imposition. Isaiah answered: ‘I saw no God, nor heard any, in a finite organical perception, but my senses discovered the infinite in everything, and as I was then perswaded, & remain confirmed, that the voice of honest indignation is the voice of God, I cared not for consequences………”

This certainly gives clues to the inward looking spiritual searches of White’s characters, but he is not content with this. He finds it necessary to wrap the final events in a cloak of Christianity to such an extent that there is a mock crucifixion. More and more Christian symbolism is heaped on the characters until they seem to sink under the weight of it all, leaving the novel in the final analysis a poorly balanced affair. It is also a novel that pretty much despises the world in which the characters live. There is very little morality and a sense of spitefulness in relations between the characters outside of those in the chariot. This is by no means an uplifting read and not my favourite Patrick White novel. I do not think it is one of his most accessible novels, but still a very fine piece of literature, which begs to be re-read. I would rate it currently at 4 stars.. .. .

A final thought; what an earth are we to make of White’s choice of names for his Characters: Mary Hare for instance the madwoman (as mad as a March Hare) Mrs Godbold the good Christian, The aboriginal artist who signs his paintings A Dubbo and there are others. The policeman to whom a fire is reported is called Mr McFaggot and the strong but brainless fiancée of one of the Godbold girls is Bob Tanner. Is Patrick White having his own little joke, should we take him seriously?

Very interesting and intriguing review, Barry. I still hope to read this during what remains of the summer, and wonder if I will have the same concerns you have.

I'm looking forward to Ken Loach's film too. I'm also a fan of Glaswegian swearing - but not whiskey...maybe my palate isn't educated enough?

A great review of Riders in the Chariot, Barry. I've just begun Voss, and Riders would be next. The emblematic names and overload of Christian symbolism make it sound like a despairing, modern Pilgrim's Progress.

Also zeno deep pockets are required to embark on a career of malt whisky drinking.

I'm still trying top digest the full Patrick White review but I thought this was particularly interesting - White rarely has a good word to say about any of his peripheral characters and so the whole novel has a sense of the Author’s fundamental dissatisfaction with the human race. I wonder if one of the issues surrounding White is that he was a borderline misanthrope, which makes it harder for readers to get into his work - and why he is more admired than loved (or read).

>106 baswood: - you can still get some nice malts between £20-30 - Old Pulteney & Bunnahabhain (two of my favourites), and others like Highland Park & for a tiny bit more a 14yo Oban.

Interesting review of Riders in the Chariot, Barry. I am finally going to read Patrick White, having found a used copy of The Vivisector. The store also had The Tree of Man, but I made the in-hindsight, regrettable decision to leave it on the shelf, as I didn't think I could carry one more book!

>Zeno, I recommend a trip to Islay, naturally with a side visit to Glasgow.

#107 Ah yes Turner "The problem with Patrick" who might well be described as a border line misanthrope. There is certainly no joie de vivre in Riders in the Chariot, but this is not the only problem.

Having now read five of his novels this year I think that Riders in the Chariot feels like "two steps back" rather than one step forward. His first available novel The Living and the Dead suffered from a certain lack of feeling for his main characters, it is as though White is one step removed from their thoughts and feelings. This I think he had largely overcome with Voss and The Tree of Man The scintillating prose passages were still their along with a certain amount of obliqueness, but I felt he got right inside the skin of his characters. In "Riders" he has not helped himself by taking so long in establishing the back stories and so as a reader we know that all this stuff has happened in the past and so I felt a little detached from it all. White always takes some time in developing his scenarios and his characters before he gets on with the story and here he has to do this four times which takes up three quarters of the book and so the "get on with it Patrick" factor was more prevalent than usual here.

I think you need to be in the right frame of mind to read Patrick White and perhaps I wasn't when I read "Riders". I feel that he was always straining to write that "great" novel, and there is some wonderful writing here with paragraphs of prose that really made me sit up, but the structure of the novel was never quite right for me.

I love Scotland and particularly the highlands and islands but have not yet made it to Islay. It will have to line up behind Jura - I want to see where Orwell lived during his attempted recovery from TB..

It's always a pleasure to read your reviews, Bas. Riders in the Chariot is a highlight. Also, that quote from William Blake is brilliant.

Thanks Dan and have a great trip.

The Jazz has started early this year. I might be listening to music and watching movies rather than reading this next couple of weeks.

Les Victoires Du Jazz
This is a competition/award ceremony for jazz artists in France, which is broadcast on French TV and this year to celebrate the tenth year of its existence and to coincide with the 35th Marciac Jazz Festival there was a concert in the chapiteau. Tickets were free for local residents and so we went along not quite knowing what to expect. We thought there might be endless speeches in true French fashion from dignitaries and sponsors, but this was not the case. The music predominated and what a great night of music it was.



Bojan Z
Bojan Z was first on stage and played solo piano before inviting a saxophonist on stage for a great duo session. Bojan plays melodically inventive piano with influences ranging from classical music to folk songs. After massive reorganisations on stage the Pierrick Pedron group hit the ground running with a muscular performance very much in the hard bop mode with elements of freer playing.

Clued in by this time that changes of equipment between groups was going to take some time, we headed for the bar, where it was very tempting to watch the rest of the concert on the video monitor, but I am glad we didn't because the next couple of acts were electric



Sandra Nkake
A diminutive woman with a powerful jazz/rock voice. She was absolutely bursting with energy and her five man group played imaginative arrangements. She was particularly effective singing a duet with the flautist. The arrangements tended more towards rock than jazz, but they finished with an electric version of Led Zeppelins "Whole Lotta Love" Eat your heart out Robert Plant I thought because Sandras Nkake's vocals out ranges Plants by some distance.

The excitement wasn't over yet because Guillaume Perrett and Electric Epic took the stage and yes they were electric. It was loud and it rocked. Perret plays saxophone, but with so many footpedal devices at his disposal he was was able to change the sound of the saxophone at will and he blew long and hard to produce some great sounds. He was backed by guitar, bass and drums, but it was Perrets show. It was great to see young musicians pushing the boundaries a little but at times it sounded a little like an early Hawkwind concert and if I closed my eyes I could imagine myself back at the Roundhouse in London forty years ago.

Some Sanda Nkake http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRjAKlWZzVE&feature=related

Some Guillame Perret http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHvS8Y093eA

Is that a "halfro"?

#115 lol

I was interested in what you said about Sandra Nkake so I checked out her website, which allows you to listen to her whole album - Nothing For Granted. I know she is better singer but her voice reminds me of Grace Jones (technically I'm not sure Grace Jones ever really sang but her middle period albums still sound great).

# 117 That is a great link Turner, it has saved me from having to buy the album. Her vocals have an excellent smokey quality especially in the lower registers.

Turner - Grace Jones middle period albums? Checking my database I have Muse, Warm Leatherette, Nightclubbing, and Slave to the Rhythm. Any recommendations?

>119 baswood: - I was thinking of the period from Nightclubbing to Slave to the Rhythm where Chris Blackwell & then Trevor Horn built up the music for her to 'sing' on top of. (I think the original blueprint for Island Grace Jones records was Marianne Faithfull's Broken English, another who isn't known for her great voice but which works in the right environment)

Francois Hollande President of France was in town yesterday. He dropped in on the Marciac Jazz Festival, spending the afternoon in town before going to the concert in the chapiteau later. He is very popular down here and there were chants of Francois Francois whenever he appeared and a big round of applause when he took his seat at the concert.



The Bad Plus with special guest Joshua Redman

The Bad Plus Piano, Bass and drums trio) and Joshua Redman were on first at the chapiteau tonight and played to an enthusiastic full house. I have always been a big fan of Joshua Redman who is one of the best of the younger jazz saxophonists around and with The Bad Plus he has found a group that will enhance his playing, giving him more avenues to explore. Redman is a player in the hard bop tradition who has taken the more freer jazz elements in his stride and is always able to build his solos into something that sounds logical but full of excitement and muscular passion. Tonight he was very much part of a group and although he played some great saxophone there was a feeling of more integration with the other players.

All The material was written by members of The Bad Plus and was introduced by Reid Anderson the bass player, whose attempts to do this in French were very much appreciated. Ethan Iverson is one of the new breed of pianists, whose influences range far and wide. He is not interested in swinging in the bop tradition or using the fractured rhythms of Monk and his school; he has absorbed the modal playing of McCoy Tyner, but his actual playing seems more concerned with melodic invention and there are classical, folk and rock influences. He was particularly good tonight in playing along with Redman's saxophone inventions, answering the phrases and providing touches that meshed with the surging lines of the saxophone. Reid Anderson on bass contributed most of the tunes tonight and the three numbers that the group finished with were truly majestic; "People Like You", "Big Eater" and "Silence is the Question" all featured wonderful playing by Redman with The Bad Plus providing fully integrated playing that enhanced the compositions. It was a group performance that at times left me wishing it would never end. Jazz is alive and well and still developing with groups like "The Bad Plus" They received a tremendous reception at the end of the performance with nearly everybody on their feet to clap and stomp their feet.

The second half of the show featured Esperanza Spalding and the Radio Music Society and I thought they would have to be inspired to reach the same levels of performance as The Bad Plus.

Esperanza Spalding

Esperanza Spalding was a sensation when she made her first appearance at Marciac a couple of years ago. She has returned in 2012 making up the second part of the show that featured The Bad Plus. She had a lot to live up to but unfortunately fell woefully short. In 2010 she had appeared with her trio but this year she was fronting a 12 piece big band and her resources as a musician were stretched beyond braking point. She had previously wowed the audience with her vocals and bass playing featuring a set of catchy tunes and thoughtful compositions, but this year her songs for the big band lacked identity and her vocals were very one dimensional. It was hard to tell the songs apart as the arrangements were far too similar and relied very much on individual soloists to carry them through.

All in all this was a thoroughly misjudged performance. The songs formed some sort of love cycle but as Esperanza's intersong commentary was all in English this was lost on the mainly French speaking audience. Actually those that could not understand it were better off as the whole concept was fraught with particularly sappy lyrics that would not have been out of place in the Eurovision Song Contest. Esperanza has over reached herself here, I am all for young artists developing and attempting to increase their range, but unfortunately Espaeranza has left herself exposed as not quite the talent that she first appeared to be. I rarely leave a concert before the end but after one and a half hours of this I had had enough, particularly as Esperanza was trying to get the audience to sing along with the band. We headed for the exit.

Is that a "halfro"?

No thats a "fulfro"

So much good stuff on this thread!

>102 baswood: Outstanding review of Riders in the Chariot, Barry. I still haven't read anything by Patrick White yet this year, although I own The Vivisector. I'll read it later this year, and I'd like to read at least one more book by him, either Voss or The Tree of Man. Which one would you recommend most?

>106 baswood: Also zeno deep pockets are required to embark on a career of malt whisky drinking.

LOL!

>114 baswood: Nice; I'll listen to those selections later this afternoon. It's hard to imagine that any US channel, with the possible exception of PBS, showing anything like that on television.

>121 baswood:, 122 Insanely jealous about the Bad Plus/Joshua Redman and Esperanza Spalding concerts, but I greatly appreciate your review of both. Hopefully they will both appear at the San Francisco Jazz Festival this fall. (I need to find a well paying job in SF, so that I can live there year round.) I saw Esperanza in 2010 when she performed with a chamber music ensemble at Davies Symphony Hall in SF (home of the San Francisco Symphony), which was intimate and unforgettable. I have her latest CD, Radio Music Society, but, oddly enough, I haven't listened to it fully yet. I'm very sorry to hear that her performance with a big band was so disappointing.

Thanks Darryl, Joshua Redman with The Bad Plus is a must for jazz fans.

I'd say so, Barry. Oddly enough, it doesn't seem as though Joshua Redman will be performing during this year's San Francisco Jazz Festival. He's from Berkeley, which is on the East Bay close to SF, and he almost always gives at least one concert during the festival.

Darryl, it would be a difficult to choose between Voss and The Tree of Man so I guess you need to read both of them.

Sonny Rollins

Sonny Rollins is a living legend and at 82 years of age he is still able to perform in concert. He played Marciac last night and I just had to go to pay homage to one of the all time greats of jazz. Extra seats needed to be crammed into the chapiteau to cope with the demand and I guess there were 6,500 people seated to see the great man. Fortunately it was a relatively cool night.

Age has taken its toll on Sonny and it was disconcerting to see him lurching onto the stage. It would appear that he is suffering from curvature of the spine and problems with his legs and hence the lurching gait. Once on stage he immediately launched into St Thomas taking a brief solo before handing over to Cliffton Anderson on Trombone and then Saul Rubin on guitar. Sonny came back with another solo spot and this time it was an extended solo with all the power, invention and lyricism that has made him famous. He finished to tremendous applause smiling and waving to the audience, he appeared to be enjoying himself and I felt privileged to hear him play. The music seemed to bring back all the authority that he commands on stage and by the time he was into the second number he was lurching around the stage playing ferociously. He played for over an hour and then took a short break before coming back to play another hours set. Familiar tunes were given the Rollins treatment and he was given tremendous support from a top class band. Kobie Watkins was brilliant behind the drumkit and the evergreen Bob Cranshaw never missed a beat on the double bass.

He came back to do an encore at the end of the show and although the audience was howling for more I was pleased that he did not feel obliged to push himself anymore. He came out twice to wave and blow kisses to us all. How we all loved him. Obviously Sonny does not play many concerts these days but I notice he is playing the Barbican in London in November. Don't miss this if you can get there.

.

>129 baswood: - sounds a great night. Can't believe he played for almost 2 hours at 82. It's great that he can still deliver the goods. (There is always that fear with artists who have entered the 'twilight years' that they are mere reflections of their former glory).

Wonderful armchair jazz, thank you bas.

>102 baswood: - Very thorough review of Riders in the Chariot. That's the one White that I have on the pile. I'm not sure when I'll get to it but it was helpful to read about the good and bad points.

The jazz festival sounded very enjoyable - too bad about the Spalding concert.

Hi detailmuse and Dief. more jazz to come......... well blues actually. It was blues night in the Chapiteau last night. Unlike a few of the jazz legends from the 1960's and 1970's there are none of the legendary blues players still alive. This of course is because most of those playing or re-discovered at that time were already well into their maturity. Marciac therefore had to turn to the next generation of blues players and came up with some of the best acts in the business for an electric night of music. It didn't always feel like the Blues though.

Habib Koite and Eric Bibb

A triple header for Marciac's night of the Blues and first on stage were Eric Bibb and Habib Koite with Mama Koine supporting the two acoustic guitarists on African percussion. The three artists were seated on stage and so we were looking to a relaxed start to the evening. Eric Bibb soloed on an old blues favourite "Going Down Slow "to kick off the evening and it was a great start. He has a rich smoky voice that can wrap itself around a tune but still have elements of the blues shout and he accompanied himself magnificently on acoustic guitar. Habib Koite is an established world music star from Mali and his music has always contained elements of the blues. He took the next number with his slightly rough tenor vocals over a guitar tuned in such a way that it resembled an African Kora. They are both excellent song writers and featured songs they had written together since Eric Bibbs first trip to Mali. The two guitar styles merged well together with the ringing tones of Koite's instrument effective in the instrumental breaks. Habib Koite is a French speaker and so he delighted the audience with stories of his friend Eric Bibb's visits to his home in Bamako. A simple duet on a song pleading for world peace went down well with the audience before they turned to playing songs from Eric BIbbs rich catalogue of music. Here Bibb's gospel background came more to the fore and his voice rose in passion to bring the set to a fine climax. They encored with Bibb's "Don't let Nobody Drag Your Spirit Down" which is a very fine song and ended the performance on a note of inspiration. The audience loved them but there was no time for more encores.



Keith B Brown
In striking contrast to Eric Bibb's acoustic set of original world/blues numbers, Keith B Browns performance was all over the place, but in a good way. He started off with a solo version of Son House's Dead letter Blues accompanying himself on acoustic bottleneck style guitar. He then brought on stage Emmanuel Ducloux on electric bass and then Etienne Prieuret also on acoustic guitar. The trio performed a couple of self penned songs which featured some amazing acoustic playing from Prieuret. Larry Crockett then took his place behind the drum kit and Pierre Sibille took his seat at the electric organ, Prieuret switched to electric guitar and the group belted out a couple of urban blues numbers. Between songs it became evident that Keith was having difficulty tuning his guitar and so he sent all his band members off stage while he performed a solo blues shout style vocal. I noticed that Prieuret had taken Keith's guitar off stage and brought it back with him successfully tuned when all the band members returned. Keith and the Band then finished the set with a couple of songs that can only be described as hard rock with solos from all the band members. It had the required effect of getting the audience on it's feet, but had very little to do with the Blues.



Keb Mo
Keb Mo and his band were playing Marciac as the final date of their European tour and the band was slick and tight as they rolled out a whole host of original material. Keb Mo has an excellent voice and his guitar playing is precise and kicks hard, just what is needed for the urban blues songs that he and the band rattled through. No tuning problems here as they faultlessly moved through their show. The songs were good and the variation in tempo's gave most of them an individual appeal. There were no ballads and only a couple of changes of guitar as Keb fingerpicked and bottlenecked his steel guitar. It was soon evident that the audience was warming to the band and by the end of the show were completely won over. Keb was all smiles as they launched into the final two numbers and the pace was relentless as the band seemed to want to cram even more songs into their set. They rocked out to a standing ovation. The band returned for a couple of encores and by this time most people had crowded down to the front or were dancing and jigging in the aisles. It was an exciting end to a superb night of music.

There was a good atmosphere in town tonight as we strolled back to our car at 2 am, still plenty of places serving food and couple of bands playing around the main square and more music seeping out from bars and clubs.

>134 baswood: Thanks for sharing all that. Sounds like it was an incredible night!

Loving the music reviews and the pictures!

All that in one night? Wow! I have Habib Koite's debut album Muso Ko, which I bought after I heard the two songs from the album that were included as sample music in Windows Vista. I've heard of Keb Mo, of course, but I don't own anything by him...yet.

I'll look for Voss and The Tree of Man when I go to London in September.

Sounds like a wonderful night, Barry. Keb Mo is a favorite of mine, although the one time I saw him in person, he played solo. We have a number of his recordings, which I think you would really enjoy, Darryl.

121 - Wonderful. I'm hopefully going to see The Bad Plus tonight - they're playing one of Lincoln Center's free outdoor concerts - an arrangement of Stravinsky’s Rite of Spring. I'm hoping the weather holds out.

I have a huge backlog of concert reviews (and book reviews for that matter) to get to. Really enjoying all of your comments on the festival.

Guillaume de Machaut 1300-1377



Guillaume de Machaut was a pivotal figure in the development of late medieval lyrics in France. He has been labelled as the "last of the trouveres (troubadors). His enormous output encompassed narrative verse, lyric verse and music and combined all three in a medieval hybrid genre known as the 'dit' (story)

His 'Livre du vrai dit' (the book of the true story) links the activities of composing poetry and music with the transcription and circulation of manuscripts and the business of arranging patronage. The Livre du vrai dit is an extremely long poem of 9,094 lines (fortunately there is no current English translation available or I would be tempted to buy it). It tells the story of the love between the elderly Machaut and an adolescent admirer; Peronne. Machaut therefore becomes a character/player in his own story and is a significant development from narrative based poems like 'The Romance of the Rose' In the story. Machaut and Peronne exchange letters and lyric poems, some of which Machaut sets to music, inserting them into the narrative along with his ideas and concerns for the arrangements he has made for the copying and publishing of his collected works. The narrative is in the tradition of a tale of courtly love and there are the usual declarations of love, the disappointments and the suffering of the lovers.

If this wasn't enough Machaut has been credited with perhaps the earliest setting of the Mass as a whole. He probably composed it for performace at the Saturday Lady Mass celebrated in Rheims cathedral. His intention seems to have been that it would function as a Mass in honour of the Virgin during the remainder of his life and after his death it would become a memorial Mass for himself and his brother, both of whom were canons in the Cathedral

Guillaume de Machaut - La Messe de Notre Dame and Songs from Le Voir Dit performed by Oxford Camerata - Director Jeremy Summerly.

I have been listening to this disc in the Naxos Early Musik series for the last couple of months and now have finally got to grips with it. It is a disc of two parts and the first is that celebrated Mass of Notre Dame and this is the part I enjoyed least. It is an all vocal performance in four and three part harmony. The information on the disc tells me it was recorded at Rheims cathedral to get an authentic sound and was recorded over a two night period in sub-zero temperatures. This may account for what I think is a poorly balanced sound. The lead vocal taken by the alto seems to suffer from some distortion as though it was too closely miked. The harshness of the sound proved to be too off putting.

The second and longest part of the disc was very much better and I have come to love some of these songs from Le Voir Dit. It is again a purely vocal performance but this time the sound appears spot on and the balance of the mainly two part harmony sounds just right. There are ballades Rondeaux and a nineteen minute Lai sung by a single tenor voice that holds my attention throughout. The accompanying booklet has both medieval French and an English translation, the performances are in the medieval French and the tunes of these secular songs are strong enough to linger in the memory. Now that I have got my ear tuned to Machaut's sound world I am eager to hear some more of his secular songs. Here is a sample of the lyrics

Since I am forgotten by you, sweet friend,
I say farewell to joy and to a life of love.
Ill-fated was the day I placed my love in you
Since I am forgotten by you sweet friend;
But what I have promised you I will maintain,
Which is that I shall never have any other lover.
Since I am forgotten by you, sweet friend,
I say farewell to joy and a life of love.

Too bad there is no English translation of the Machaut -- my French is way too rusty and elementary to hazard the original.

Very interesting about the music.

Anthony Strong

The concert in the chapiteau a couple of nights ago, featured Dianna Reeves and Gregory Porter, but I decided to pass on this and go to see Anthony Strong at L'Astrada instead. It was a pleasant evening, not too hot and just right for drinking a few glasses of Colombelle the local fruity white wine served from a kiosk outside the concert hall. I was tempted by the new Colombelle 'fizz' but this proved to be just fizzy colombelle and I prefer my fruity white wines without the added fizz..

Anthony Strong is an up and coming British jazz vocalist and piano player, rather in the mould of Jamie Callum and Michael Bublie, I wish I had known this before I went to see him as I would have avoided his concert as well. He is a talented young singer and pianist absolutely full of himself and he had brought with him a number of fans who made themselves known in the audience. He led a quintet which included a saxophone and trumpet player, but they had very little to do and seemed to be reduced to making funny remarks between themselves and I somehow got the feeling that these might have been at Anthony Strong's expense. Strong played and sang well but neither his vocals or his piano playing were outstanding. His witty remarks between songs were largely wasted on the French audience and his British fans must have heard them all before. The songs tended towards the more popular end of the canon with only one real disaster and this was a rendition of Jerry Lee Lewis's "Whole Lotta Shakin Going on", which neither rocked or swung and was devoid of any excitement. I thought he showed most promise when he played and sang a couple of his own compositions.

I think he would have sounded pretty good in a small club atmosphere but in a 600 seater concert hall he was a bit exposed. He got an encore and by and large we were all well enough entertained, but I would have been just as happy drinking more of the white wine outside the concert hall.

During the jazz festival the cinema gets in on the act by showing a continuous run of films vaguely connected with music. I saw "You Instead" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1672845/ aka "Rock n Love or "tonight your mine" which has a vague connection to music as it features a day and a night at a Scottish Rock festival.

Over at the Internet Movie Database this film has a poor rating, but I thought it deserves much higher. The depiction of a Scottish rock festival complete with rain, mud and enthusiastic rock fans looked very realistic and as a slice of life story it hit the spot with me. A rock musician from a chart topping American duo gets into an altercation with a female singer with a local band. As the argument develops a mystic/preacher man enters the scene and handcuffs the two of them together. There is no key to the handcuffs and no bolt cutters available and so the protagonists have to spend a day and a night handcuffed together and their respective partners are not pleased. From this unrealistic scenario a very realistic film develops which was made enjoyable through some excellent performances. A quirky little film and the sort of movie I really like.

The realism of the film was nailed down by it being almost entirely shot at The Tin the Park music festival in Scotland. This is an annual festival that takes place on a disused airfield in Kinross-shire. After spending an hour and a half amongst all that rain and mud it was a relief to step outside the cinema into sunshine and the pavements of Marciac. I am too old for rock festivals.

Just to give a feel of T in the Park here's an image from this year -

I have to admit I've never even heard of that film so I'm guessing even in Scotland it had a limited release.

Back inside the nice warm chapiteau for Saturdays concert.



Angelique Kidjo has been described as a diva of African music and has become equally famous for her work for peace and for women's empowerment. Tonight her political message was in support of Amnesty International, but it was her performance as singer/songwriter that was of principle concern for most of us at the Marciac Jazz Festival. Her music is a mixture of many styles but currently it seems easiest to classify it as Afropop. She fronted a small group of two percussionists a drummer and in Dominic James a superb guitarist who was equally at home on acoustic as well as electric guitars. It was Angelique's show and her powerful vocals rang out clear and true to thrill us all. The majority of her songs were self penned with rhythmic upbeat tempos and they built up to a sort of celebration in song. No one worried about the jazz content we were all too concerned with letting ourselves go to some joyful music. Some short speeches between numbers drew applause, but Angelique judged these well enough and was soon back to belting out her songs.

She was all too soon into her last songs for the evening and her irrepressible character spilt over as she took a walk around the auditorium and returned to the stage with a host of young people and Amnesty International supporters to dance and jig to her final song. She seemed happy to be surrounded by people as she mingled amongst the gyrating folk on stage.



Lucky Peterson



Wynton Marsarlis Quintet with Lucky Peterson

The second part of the show was all Wynton Marsarlis as he treated the faithful to some concert hall blues. Lucky Peterson augmented the group with his rich dark blues vocals and played some blues licks on the guitar, but seemed content to stay sat on his chair, while Wynton called the shots. The repertoire was blues at its most traditional; they played "Down by the Riverside", "C C Rider", "St James Infirmary" "Irene", "Amazing Grace" etc all tunes that most people would be very familiar with. They of course played them faultlessly and Wynton on trumpet and Walter Blanding on saxophone took most of the solo space. An accomplished evening of music making and quite a contrast with Angelique Kidjo's joyful performance earlier. At Marciac, Wyunton can do no wrong and the audience loved it, especailly when Wynton started to take over most of the vocal duties, he has a decent voice, but I would have much preferred to have heard more from Lucky Peterson, who seemed to produce some clouding of Wynton's genial facial expressions when he departed a little from the script and improvised with his vocals.

I was thinking that the only blues standard they hadn't got round to playing was "When the Saints Go Marching In", but I needn't have worried because this was rolled out for their first encore. I do not know how many encores there were, because we left after the fourth, preferring to catch some free music around town.

>147 baswood: - I've been a big fan of Angelique Kidjo's since she almost had a hit with Agolo (http://www.tagtele.com/videos/voir/12758/) back in the mid-1990s. (When I say almost had a hit I mean it got played on hipper radio shows of the time). This is a great cover she did a while ago - Voodoo Chile.

Lucky Peterson, who seemed to produce some clouding of Wynton's genial facial expressions when he departed a little from the script and improvised with his vocals. Interesting - hasn't the criticism of Marsalis over the years been that he treats jazz almost like chamber music and tries to reproduce the sound of earlier performers rather than fully embrace the spirit of the music?

>144 baswood: overall and
>147 baswood: Lucky Peterson, who seemed to produce some clouding of Wynton's genial facial expressions when he departed a little from the script and improvised with his vocals
-- interesting, uncomfortable, and disappointing!

>145 baswood: but so glad the camera turned to a pic of you and Mrs bas

#149 lol - 40 years ago maybe, but then I didn't know Mrs bas 40 years ago, although we were at the same rock festivals.

#148 I have seen Wynton Marsalis five times over the last four years and I usually go to see the artists he is appearing with rather than Wynton's own group. I suppose you could say he plays traditional jazz and blues with all the edges smoothed over and I like my music to have plenty of edges. However he is a superb trumpet player and I am always amazed by his playing. I am ambivalent about him.

We had not booked seats for Sunday nights concert, but on a whim decided we would like to go and a visit to the booking office secured for us a couple of seats right to the far side of the chapiteau in an area we had never ventured to before. We found that our seats were in the front row of one of the side aisles and in front of us was an empty space leading down to the side of the stage. As the concert got underway it soon became apparent that this space was being filled up-by mainly young people some of whom were acting as "helpers" for the Festival, but many had simply bunked in by climbing over the fence.

Kyle Eastwood probably more famous for being Clint Eastwood's son than a jazz musician was on first. He plays double bass and leads an established group through material mainly written by himself that can be best described as modern jazz. The group dynamics were good; Quentin Collins on trumpet and Grahame Blevins on saxophone played some excellent solos and the material was strong. The space in front of us was becoming more busy and we were in danger of getting high from all the dope being smoked around us. It was great that everyone was listening to and enjoying the music and we soon did not notice all the shuffling around. Kyle Eastwood's set finished and an enthusiastic reception got the group back on stage for an encore. They played an old jazz standard "Big Noise from Winnetka".



Marcus Miller

It was the Marcus Miller group that most of the young people had come to see and he played the second half of the concert. He is a favourite at the festival and walked on to great applause. He is a multi instrumentalist but has made his name with his innovative fretless bass playing. He has developed a style of slapping the strings of his electric bass to produce a funky sound that has now been widely copied. His jazz credentials are beyond dispute having been a member of a Miles Davis Group and been responsible for all the songs on Miles's Tutu recording. Tonight he led an electric group featuring Adam Agati on electric guitar, Kris Bowers; keyboards, Alex Han on saxophone and Sean Jones on trumpet. It was going to be a night of high voltage music straying into the realms of Jazz Rock. It was loud and Miller was in great form playing exciting solos on his fretless bass. The intensity of the performance went a bit over the top with the saxophone and trumpet solos as each player was too quick to get to those high harmonic notes to ramp up the excitement and much of their playing became too similar. The guitarist however was very good and there was always those wonderful bass lines from Miller He slowed the pace down by playing a couple of numbers on the bass clarinet before launching into the final sequence of songs that had most of the young people in front us on their feet dancing.

It was an exciting performance and he left the stage after his second encore with the youngsters baying for more.

Oh yes the picture above is of Marcus Miller who probably would not be mistaken for Clint Eastwood's son.

Two more Festival favourites on a great double bill in the chapiteau on Monday night

Avishai Cohen



Avishai Cohen's concerts just seem to get better and better. He was not quite so manic tonight (his shirt stayed on) but he played with an intensity that was fascinating to watch. He was with his regular trio: Omri Mor on piano and Amir Bresler on drums. and stuck to playing his upright double bass. He has written some great tunes and these were captured well by Omri Mor's piano. Cohen and his brilliant drummer took most of the solo spots and both played with an authority that must come from people who regularly play together. The audience was enthralled and he got a standing ovation at the conclusion to his set. He came back on his own for encores stating that he was going to play on and we were treated to three more of his songs this time he sang while accompanying himself on double bass. He was joined by the rest of the trio for a couple more songs and the audience did not want to let him go, perhaps because some of them knew what was coming next.



John Zorn's Book of Angels compositions of John Zorn

The first group to play these John Zorn compositions were a heavy metal outfit Shanir Blumenkranz's Abraxas:



When they took to the stage and Shanir started strumming heavy chords out of his three stringed bass guitar which looked like something he had cobbled together himself, I knew what we were in for and soon the two electric guitarists were playing fast and loud and the drummer was pounding out a heavy rock rhythm on his kit. It did not take too long before a number of the audience took to the night air outside the chapiteau. It was improvisation but not as many of the people in the audience would have known it. Me, well I like the odd spot of metal, even death metal and these guys on stage could really play. They played four songs which sharply divided the people remaining in their seats as you either wanted to yell out for more or you sat quietly hoping they had finished.

They had finished and their mentor John Zorn took to the stage with his Aleph trio. Chris Smith on drums proved to be the perfect foil for Zorn's avant garde improvisations on his tenor saxophone. He has an astonishing range and with his trick of circular breathing is able to play series of notes without pausing. His dynamic duo's with his young drummer were a feature of his all too short set. He left the stage and the third group came on: Secret Chiefs 3 They are a Turkish influenced rock group that feature the electric violin playing of Timba Harris and the two guitarists; Troy Spuance and Gyan Riley. We were back into rock rhythms and the decibel count rose again making those who were thinking they might leave early, decide to head for the exit. The group were excellent and got a great reception from those that were left in the chapiteau. For an encore John Zorn came back on stage with Abraxas and he directed all his disciples for a rousing finale to the evening. John Zorn had brought heavy metal music to the Marciac Jazz Festival and I think he got away with it. What an exciting evening.

Well - thats it from the Jazz Festival this year. There are still a few concerts left, but they don't really appeal; I didn't fancy Hairy Cronnick jnr or Ruben Blades and the final concert is a typical French jazz manouche evening and I have seen too many of them. The clubs and restaurants and a host of street musicians will still be functioning until next Tuesday, so there is still plenty to pop into town for.

Fabulous Jazz Festival reviews, Barry! There are many artists here who I've heard of, but am unfamiliar with, such as Avishai Cohen and Keb Mo. I'll start to explore them over the next few months, and hopefully see some of them in San Francisco or elsewhere.

The Prince (A Norton Critical Edition by Niccolo Machiavelli, translated by Robert M Adams.

“This is why armed prophets always win and unarmed prophets lose”

“A prince therefore should have no other object, no other thought, no other subject of study, than war; its rules and disciplines”

“It is good to appear merciful, truthful, humane, sincere and religious, it is good to be so in reality, But you must keep your mind so disposed that in case of need you can turn to the exact contrary”

“If you have to make a choice; to be feared is much safer than to be loved. For it is a good general rule about men; that they are ungrateful, fickle, liars and deceivers, fearful of danger and greedy for gain.”

These quotes from Machiavelli’s The Prince are one of the reasons he has received such a bad press, however most successful politicians and all ruling tyrants would wholeheartedly agree with the sentiments. This is a clue I think to why when we read Machiavelli today we still find him disturbing, it is as though he has lifted a stone to let us peer beneath and our only concern is to replace the stone as quickly as possible.

Machiavelli was concerned to give technical advice to a Prince (and for Prince we can substitute any ruler including republicans) on how he should retain power and rule his subjects. Some of this advice has become notorious, for instance; one must employ terrorism or kindness according to the situation faced, it is best to keep people poor and always prepared for war, competition between classes in society is desirable because it promotes energy and enterprise, religion must be promoted even though it may be false as it preserves social solidarity, if your actions must be drastic get it over with quickly so that it is soon forgotten and do not advertise it beforehand or your enemies might destroy you, ensure that you extinguish the line of any previous rulers. There are plenty more gems like this but Machiavelli was not out to promote wickedness, he was concerned with writing a treatise that would appear real, practical and useful to its recipient. He says:in a note to the magnificent Lorenzo de Medici:

“I wanted my book to be absolutely plain, or at least distinguished only by the variety of the examples and the importance of the subject”

To understand Machiavelli it is useful to know more about the circumstances of his composition of “The Prince”

Machiavelli served for 15 years in public service to the republican rulers (committee of ten) in Florence. He carried out many diplomatic duties, some of which involved negotiations with the infamous Cesare Borgia. (whom he admired). The Florentine state had no regular army and had to rely on mercenaries and at that time both France and Spain were pushing to annexe territory in Italy. The Florentines survived by diplomacy and skills as merchants, but Machiavelli realised this was not enough and put together his own army. His worst fears were confirmed when the Florentine army was easily routed by Spanish regulars who restored the Medici as the ruling faction in Florence. Machiavelli was imprisoned and tortured but finally allowed to retire to the countryside with the proviso that he should take no further part in politics. He therefore had a wealth of experience as a politician in renaissance Italy, which was a time when force prevailed and murder and war were common place. Machiavelli lived for his public life and almost in desperation penned The Prince in 1513, which he planned to give to Lorenzo Duke of Urbino, as a way back into public life. He was therefore intent on writing a guide for rulers, ones who were steeped in the practicalities of surviving in turbulent times and who were not interested in idealism or dogma. As far as we know he never got his treatise presented to Lorenzo and manuscript copies leaked out, with a bowdlerised copy printed just four years before Machiavelli’s death in 1523.

The Prince takes just 68 pages to say what it has to say, but ever since its publication it has proved to hold a fascination for political thinkers and philosophers, much has been written about it and |I am sure that Machiavelli would be flattered by the attention it has received, but what makes it so worthy of our attention apart from the obvious fact that it is an important social document. Isaiah Berlin thinks he has the answer in his essay “The Question of Machiavelli” included here in The Norton Critical Edition. Machiavelli’s huge step forward was to deny that morality (Christian Morality) had a place in politics. He did not deny the validity of Christian morality but said that if you wanted to bring morality into politics you would be destroyed. In politics crimes might have to be committed it did not make them right, but all the same they were necessary for the greater good (of the ruler certainly). If you wanted to follow a moral code then stay out of politics and take the consequences.

Also I think there were other reasons why Machiavelli’s treatise seemed so radical. He thought that the idea of fortune’s wheel was an anachronism. Man could to a certain extent control his own destiny. Sure fortune could be good or bad but the wise ruler could use both to his own advantage. Machiavelli’s ideas on the creation of an army of local volunteers loyal to the state were also extremely relevant to the times in which he lived and if he had been successful in getting such an army up to speed, he would have been as great an expansionist as Cesare Borgia. Machiavelli was also concerned to use plenty of examples of ‘good practice’ from antiquity and so the book has a feeling of paganism about it, there are also examples used from recent Florentine history, but these are more often than not negative.

The Prince is not a difficult read especially in The Norton Critical edition translated by Robert M Adams. It is well annotated and the edition also contains excerpts from Machiavelli’s discourses, letters from his time as a working diplomat and some poetry. There is also an excellent selection of essays by critics and historians that add considerably to the reading experience and certainly to the size of the book, which including appendices and an index clocks in at over 300 pages. I thoroughly enjoyed it and as an example of putting a text in context then the Norton edition works superbly. It is “The Princes” 500th birthday next year and I wholeheartedly recommend it. A five star read.

Wonderful review of The Prince. I had to read it a couple of times for university, and enjoyed it too. I have a soft spot for Machiavelli, because his picture could be a picture of my father-n-law. They're both from the same region of Italy, and so I like to imagine that my husband--and my kids--are descendents of his family. I can tell you that my husband definitely has some Machiavellian moments. ;-)

Excellent review of The Prince, Barry.

Glad to see you back to books, Barry. Excellent review. The Prince was popular when I was in high school and I read it then, although I think it was mostly lost on me at that point.

Excellent review, Barry, with some nice background information. I re-read The Prince last year in an older translation without the benefit of notes, but still found it easy to comprehend. Subsequently I read Hobbes's Leviathan which frequently explicitly addresses and attempts to refute Machiavelli's advice--just showing that a century later his work was influential enough to demand a rebuttal by anyone writing political philosophy.

Darryl, I bought and downloaded a lot of music from artists appearing at the Festival. I hope to get round to listening to it this year and I'll talk about it on my thread.

The political doctrine of Machiavelli, which denies the relevance of morality in political affairs and holds that craft and deceit are justified in pursuing and maintaining political power

characterized by subtle or unscrupulous cunning, deception, expediency, or dishonesty: He resorted to Machiavellian tactics in order to get ahead

Joyce, the above are two current definitions of Machiavellianism, something that Niccolo could not have anticipated would be in use 500 years after he wrote his treatise.

Linda, jane, steven, it would seem that The Prince is one of the prescribed books to be read in American schools. I never came across it at school in England. I wonder if this is because of Machiavelli's leaning towards republicanism.

steven I hope to get to Hobbes next year.

#161 - Yes, I meant it both in the way it was written 500 yrs ago, and the way it is used today. My comment was made tongue-in-cheek. My husband has a very, let's say, "pragmatic" view of situations and people's motives.

Pragmatic is a good word Joyce - Machiavelli would have approved.

Fascinating review of the Machiavelli. I read it decades ago in college, and perhaps it's time for a reread.

Really informative review of The Prince. I read it awhile back but I remember mine didn't have an intro so the background was helpful.

Fabulous review of The Prince, Barry! I'll pick up that edition of it next month.

rebecca, Dief and Darryl, thanks for stopping by. rebecca posed a question recently on another thread asking if reading about a certain subject would lead you to read more about it later and my answer was I can all too easily become hooked on a subject and so for the moment it is Machiavelli.

I have just finished The Comedies of Machiavelli and am also reading a book of essays on his literary works, but it does not stop there as I have ordered:

Discourses on Livy
The Letters of Machiavelli
and will probably read anything that I can download for free from the Gutenburg Project.

My wife is already getting fed up with me prefacing many of my answers to questions with "well Machiavelli would say......."

You've probably seen this but The Guardian ran an eight-part series on The Prince (Part One).

The Comedies of Machiavelli Bi lingual edition edited and translated by David Sices and James B Atkinson.

Could the man famous for championing, cunning and deceit as a means to an end in political tracts like The Prince also write frothy comedies that would make playhouse audiencies roll about in the aisles? Well the short answer to this is yes, but of course all is not what it seems.

Machiavelli wrote his plays during the last ten years of his life when he was largely on forced retirement from politics, but was still eager to return in some way to public life and his celebrated affair with the actress Barbara may well have been an added incentive.
He was quite aware of what was needed t produce a successful play as he said in his “Discourse or Dialogue Concerning Our Language”:

“In this category are comedies, for though the aim of comedy is to hold up a mirror to domestic life, the way it does this , all the same, is with a certain urbanity and with expressions which excite laughter, so that men who come eagerly to enjoy themselves, taste afterwards the useful lessons that lay beneath”

“Those useful lessons that lay beneath” were probably what interested Machiavelli most as he still felt he had something to say, however those useful lessons had nothing to do with Christian morality, quite the opposite in fact.

There are three plays ably translated by David Sices and James B Atkinson, however the first of these: The Woman from Andros is pretty much a straight translation by Machiavelli from Terence (classical Greek playwright) and so while well done, did not interest me that much. The second play Mandragola (The Mandrake) has been claimed as evidence that Machiavelli was “greatest dramatist of his age” and a seminal influence upon important traditions of European drama, it was certainly a big hit in its day, with the Pope insisting that the original scenery be transported from Florence to Rome for a command performance. It is set in Florence and tells a story that could have come straight from the pen of Boccaccio. Callimaco has returned from Paris to Florence following reports of Nicia’s wife Lucrezia being a woman of outstanding beauty. When he sees her his only thought is to get into bed with her, but she is a virtuous woman and will have nothing to do with him. Callimaco has cultivated a parasite in Ligurio who has wormed his way into Nicia’s household and it is Ligurio who comes up with all the ideas as to how Callimaco can be successful. The conspiracy is all based around Lucrezia’s desire to have children, which she cannot do with Nicia. Callimaco disguised as a doctor persuades Nicia that he can provide a potion that will guarantee success, but the only drawback is that it must be taken by the male and he will die one week after he drinks the potion. The conspirators involve Friar Timoteo and Lucrezia’s mother in law in persuading Lucrezia, that she should sleep with the potion taker to become pregnant. The plan is to capture a likely looking young man to do the deed and it is here that the real farce starts as it is Calimaco in disguise as a youth who is captured.. In fact everybody is in disguise as Calimaco is led to Lucrezias bed and Nicia is spying on them to ensure business is done. Lucrezia enjoys her night with Calimaco and after he declares his love for her she ensures that he will be a frequent guest to her house.

The final play is Clizia, which is again set in Florence and the plot centres on the house-hold of Nicomaco where he and his son both want to bed Clizia who is a 15 year old ward. They both do not reckon on Sofronia; wife of Nicomaco who has other ideas. There are in effect three conspiracies going on here; Nicomaco wants his servant the worthless Pirro to wed Clizia so that he can have access to her, Sofronia suggests Eustachio their estates manager who would at least provide some security while the poor love sick son Cleandro is clueless how he is going to be successful and relies on his friend Palamede for suggestions. Nicomaco is finally outsmarted by the more resourceful Sofronia who has a male servant Spiro, dressing up as Clizia and so when Nicomaco gets into what he believes is Clizia’s bed he has a rude shock and Spiro extracts the ultimate revenge. Everybody in the household hears the outrage perpetrated on Nicomaco and the only choice that Nicomaco has to avoid the scandal is to give in to his wife who has carte blanche to marry off Clizia.

Mandragola has been revived as a stage play successfully in the 1970’s and 1990’s in England, but Clizia to my knowledge has not, but out of the two I found Clizia to be the more entertaining to read. Both plays are witty, and Mandragola has the most laugh out loud moments, but I prefer Clizia because it is the more adventurous and well rounded play and it is also the most Machiavellian.

Machiavelli clearly wanted his comedies to have a lasting impression, he was keen that his message should get across and so it is interesting to think about just what this message might be and how successful he was in delivering it. In Clizia the author’s role is clearly delineated in the long prologue where the actors are introduced, their characters revealed and the author takes time to apologise for any indecencies that might offend. Machiavelli takes charge and although he might apologise one suspects ironically, he does not apologise for the immorality in his play. In both Mandragola and Clizia his characters have no respect for morals, they go hell for leather unashamedly after what they want and in both cases it is sex, not love. The conspirators that are the cleverest and take the most risks are the ones that are successful in the end. Christian morality, the church and even the master-servant relationship are the subject of some stinging satire. All this is pure Machiavelli, however what is perhaps more surprising is the role of women who come out on top in both plays, not because of any turn of the wheel of fortune, but because they have managed things better. The theme running through these plays is that those people of whatever rank, who show the most ingenuity and who are not afraid to go for the main chance are the most likely to succeed.

It is tempting to compare the affairs of the households in the plays with the affairs of the state in Machiavelli’s The Prince and of course many similarities will be found, however we have an advantage over Machiavelli’s audience as most of them would not have been able to see a copy of The Prince to make a comparison. The message of the plays must then stand alone and we can only guess what the audience thought of them, although we know they enjoyed the performances and there is much to be enjoyed. Machiavelli’s comedies pick easy targets and fools, impotent old men, grasping friars, too lusty lovers are all the subject of ridicule. Machiavelli’s razor sharp mind has produced some razor sharp wit and I was entertained.

.

Barry - have your read Fortune is a River? It's about a fascinating chapter in history when Machiavelli and Leonardo Da Vinci worked on a project to divert the course of the Arno in order to screw Pisa. A bit of an academic read, but I found it fascinating. Maybe because I have family in the area and know the places. But it's interesting that the general hatred of Pisa that existed then still exists in Tuscany today.

edited to add: I haven't seen that second picture of Machiavelli, but the eyes and mouth look like my father-in-law too. It's spooky.

Thanks for that Joyce Fortune is a River has been added to my to buy list. Interesting about Pisa.

I had seen somewhere that Machiavelli wrote something called Mandragola, but had no idea what it was or that he had written other plays. Both it and Clizia sound well worth reading. And the idea of turning master/servant male/female relationships topsy turvy is certainly consistent with the premise behind The Prince that one must rule through astute use of one's abilities rather than relying on a shared idea of divine right or social hierarchy.

#168 Thanks for the link Turner. I hadn't seen it

>170 baswood: - the plot of Mandragola sounded familiar so I assumed I had seen it on stage at one time. Then I remembered I had seen it at the cinema - The Mandrake Root. I can't recommend it one way or the other as I can't recall much more about it.

Another great link Turner.

Excellent review of The Comedies of Machiavelli, Barry. I'm not much interested in reading them, but I always come away from your reviews feeling that I have learned something.

In May I read and reviewed Susan Cooper's science-fiction novel Mandrake, but did not look up the meaning and significance of the name of character "Mandrake", as in the title of the book. I had simply assumed it an odd name.

Mandrake is, apparently, known as the "love plant" and the potion made from the root may make drowsy, hence Machiavelli's use of it in his play. Mandragola (The Mandrake). The same reference is found in Shakespeare's Othello:

"...Not poppy, nor mandragora,
Nor all the drowsy syrups of the world,
Shall ever medicine thee to that sweet sleep
Which thou owedst yesterday."

Other references to the plant mandrake are based on the shape of the root in human form. The mandrake is shaped as a man or the virile parts of a man; it is an described as an android appearance which is germinated without the concurrence of women (created from the semen of a hanged man dripping on the earth). Legend has it that when the root is dug up it sighs, howls and screams in such a frightful manner that it kills all who hear it. (Grimm’s Saga No. 84: "Der Alraun" (= "The Mandrake".)

There are two references to this aspect in Shakespeare:

"Shrieks like mandrakes' torn out of the earth."

Romeo and Juliet IV.iii

"Would curses kill, as doth the mandrake's groan"

King Henry VI part II III.ii

Susan Cooper's science-fiction novel Mandrake is rich in references to this latter aspect. The movement to persuade all British citizens to return to their roots, for instance, and the idea that "uprooting" kills. The Guild of Women, an organization of women sprung up in every town is more significant in light of the legend surrounding the Mandrake, more so because women of the Guild are not exactly in league with the Mandrake in the novel, and are also destroyed by the Earth. However, references are mixed with various other elements.

I was even more surprised to find that there are numerous references to the Mandrake in contemporary literature and even computer games including D.H. Lawrence describing the mandrake as a "weed of ill-omen', Rowling's Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets and Rushdie's The Enchantress of Florence.

Susan Cooper wrote just one novel for adults. I guess with Mandrake she had her (misunderstood?) go at phallic symbolism and the receptive Mother Earth. After Mandrake she only wrote books for children.

And don't forget Donne's "Get with child a mandrake root."

Thanks for all that interesting stuff edwin.



The Mandrake Root

MANDRAKE ROOT

Vagina Dentata I love you so,
You are wide as my dreams are long,
Like the kipling hiss of the cobra,
Or the screams of Fay Ray in King Kong.

Vestal of fire lethargic
Whose seminal doctrines extract
The rivets from Caliban's backbone
To leave him less fiction than fact.

Aphrodite Urania we need you
To lighten the people's path
By the marvellous insights of Crippen
Or the Brides in the Bath.

O precious pudendum of seeming,
We come from the Gullible Isles,
Where the cannibal complexes frolic
And the Mona Lisa smiles.

Lawrence Durrell

Not all Mandrake is bad or dangerous.



Mind you the cigarette smoking may make him a villain now.

Love the poem.

There is also the 1911 novel Alraune by Hanns Heinz Ewers which features mandrakes of the vegetal variety as well as an experiment where a prostitute is artificially impregnated with the semen of a hanged man, creating a girl child/mandrake of a perverse and violent nature.

I am not going to get sidetracked on all thing Mandrakian, but Alraune looks interesting.

Wow! You've touched on something and suddenly all over the place Mandrakes are screaming to see the light of day.

Alraune by Hanns Heinz Ewers sounds incredibly perverse to me. I already had shudders at the thought of seed dripping on the earth from hanged men. Using it to impregnate a girl is a rather disgusting idea.

I am surprised how many readers that book has on LT!

Bas - Wonderful review of The Prince, and also of M's comedies.

Edwin - You have managed to enrich Harry Potter for me. :) (see #178)

Lost in Translation: A Life In a New Language
“If all therapy is speaking therapy-a talking cure-then perhaps all neurosis is a speech dis-ease”

Eva Hoffman is fascinated by words and fascinated by language and her autobiographical “Lost in Translation” is at times a brilliant thesis on the situation of an exile living abroad. It is also a lively and extremely well written personal account of a Jewish woman coming to terms with her former life in Poland and the new life she has made for herself in America.

Eva’s book is in three parts and the first of these is titled “Paradise” and describes her early life in Poland until as an 11 year old she emigrated to Canada with her parents. Her formative years in Poland takes on a rosy glow as she recounts a very happy childhood, however there is an undercurrent to her memories. Her parents are Jewish and they had fled to the Ukraine to escape the holocaust and now back in Cracow they are outsiders to the mainstream of Polish life. Hoffman creates a feeling of being one step apart from her Polish neighbours through the eyes and thoughts of herself as a child and with the hindsight of an adult, with some seamless writing. Life in Poland is not quite Paradise, but it is comfortably secure in a way that America never is for Eva. The importance of friendships, of family, of an identity and a place in the world comes through, but the other side of this is a recognition that the Jewish community is still under threat and results in the family’s decision to emigrate.

Part two is titled “Exile” and Eva tells of her early teen years in Canada (Vancouver) and her College life at Rice University in Texas and then at Harvard University. She captures perfectly the difficulties of learning a new language and adapting to a new culture. She is a gifted pupil in both literature and music and finds that her peers at school and University are so different that at times she feels like an alien. It is though she is trapped inside herself as the childish behaviour of the young Canadians leaves her bemused. Their values are different and the language and cultural barrier leaves her unable to express herself properly, but her desire to learn and to fit in gets her through. She says:

“But these days, it takes all my will to impose any control on the words that emerge from me. I have to form entire sentences before uttering them; otherwise, I too easily get lost in the middle. My speech I sense, sounds monotonous, deliberate, heavy-an aural mask that doesn't become me or express me at all. This willed self-control is the opposite of real mastery, which comes from a trust in your own verbal powers and leads to a free streaming of speech, for those bursts of spontaneity, the quickness of response that can rise into pleasure and overflow into humour. Laughter is the lightning rod of play, the eroticism of conversation; for now, I’ve lost the ability to make the sparks fly”

Passages like this express perfectly the difficulties and frustrations for immigrants who have to make their way in a country where they need to learn a new language. Hoffman also pins down perfectly the cultural difficulties that appear once progress in the new language has been made; how in conversation with native speakers so many things are 'a given' to them but for the newcomer this is not the case leading to missteps at the least and a comical floundering and even insults at the worst.

Part three “The New World” describes Eva’s adult life and success in America. She finds that she can use her different cultural background to her advantage as well as her new approach to the English language. Her differences can be appealing to others and she forges ahead in a society, whose rules she assiduously learns and uses to her own advantage. It is in this final section of her book that she takes time to reflect on Cultural life in America recognising the differences and the vastness of the country. Life in New York is compared to life in Cracow; Poland and not always to its advantage. As an academic she reflects on cultural differences, on language and the use of words interspersed with snapshots of incidents in her life. The way her writing changes from the real world around her to thoughts on life’s big issues reminded me a little of Robert M Pirsig's wonderful “Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance”

As an outsider she considers that she is able to stand back and reflect on American life and a visit back to Poland reinforces her thoughts. She can view herself as two people; one whose life would have been so different had she remained in Poland. She is also able to criticise aspects of American life and finds it rather amusing that she ends up going to see a shrink like so many of her American friends. This leads her to thoughts on loss of identity, not just her own, but also something that is endemic in many of her American friends. Finally she attempts to draw some conclusions:

“No, there’s no returning to the point of origin, no regaining of childhood unity. Experience creates style, and style, in turn creates a new woman…….. Like everybody I am the sum of my languages-the languages of my family and childhood, and education and friendship, and love and the larger changing world-though perhaps I tend to be more aware than most of the fractures between them, and of the building blocks…….”

With its concentration on certain aspects of American society, part three did not have the same impact for me as the previous sections of the book, and this I think is because I could not personally relate to all of the issues raised. Hoffman’s views on the American (New York, academic) way of life, might be viewed as antagonistic by some although they seem to chime with more populist views of America, at least with those of outsiders.

As an Englishman now resident in France and struggling to cope with the language and cultural differences, Eva Hoffman’s book really spoke to me. It was chosen as a next read by my English book club group and I am sure that they will all identify with Hoffman’s insightful thoughts on some of the difficulties facing new immigrants. I have to say I loved this book; there were so many “Oh Yes” moments and it is one that I will certainly want to re-read. Unhesitatingly recommended

Thank you for reminding me why I loved Lost in Translation when I read it many years ago.

Great review baswood.

Lost in Translation sounds wonderful, Barry. Thanks for the enticing review.

Great review of what sounds like a fascinating book.

I have to form entire sentences before uttering them...

I do this even in my native (and only) language, and always have. I suppose it's just a matter of personality.

This willed self-control is the opposite of real mastery...

From my own experience and observation, there are two types of language learners: those who feel inhibited to speak before complete mastery out of fear to make mistakes, and the happy-go-lucky who use all kinds of compensation strategies to fill up the gaps in their grammatical and lexical knowledge.

The author of Lost in translation seems to belong to that first group; the latter are often much less encumbered and ultimately more successful, because the best way of learning is by practice and blundering a lot.

#193 I observed this when I visited my American friend who moved to Paris. Her French was MUCH better than mine but she was hesitant to speak with French people because it wasn't perfect. I had no illusions about the lack of perfection of my French, so I felt much freer to try talking.

Outstanding review of Lost in Translation, Barry. I'll look for it next month.

Thanks Darryl, steven, jonathan and Linda.

edwin and rebecca, I think that learning a language is similar to learning almost anything in that people respond to different methods of learning, the only thing that everyone needs to do is to work at it. Eva Hoffman was a very bright student with a fascination for language and a need to express herself as accurately as she could, she had ambitions of being academic and so 'getting it correct' was important to her.

My own situation here in France is a little different. There is a reasonable sized English community around town and so one could get by with just a few French words. However in the village/commune where I live only one of my French neighbours speaks any English and so if I want to communicate (which I do) I must speak French. Similarly it is usual for local officials not to speak English; there is a notice in the tax office at Auch (the provincial town) that says in English 'If you have a tax query you must bring an interpreter with you'

In my situation I have to use edwin's method of blundering on in French the best I can (even pronouncing English words with a French accent helps on occasions) I know I should pay more attention to my French grammar, but it is way down on my list of priorities and I console myself with increasing my French vocabulary as much as I can.

>195 baswood:

Although in many areas I would regard myself as a perfectionist, I have always blundered on generously and hilariously in various languages, such as in Spanish, where I made the typical beginners' mistake of confusing "introducir" and "presentar" in the sentence "Let me introduce myself" (false friends).

In everyday Chinese vocabulary is truncated to avoid cumbersome long words. So a long word, such as BeiJing DaXue becomes BeiDa, but the choice of word parts (characters) is not regular, that is to say, it depends on the meaning and the existence of other expressions in the language.

One day, I ran out of coffee creamer (milk powder) which is NiuNaiFen, so I asked my friend to buy me NiuFen. I should have asked him to buy NaiFen, because:

Niu Nai = Cow milk
Nai Fen = Milk Powder
Niu Fen = Bull Shit (literally Dung).

Wuthering Height, Emily Bronte
Wonderfully Overwrought - Confusingly Incestuous. 4 stars

>197 baswood: Perfect review!

#187 - noting Lost in Translation, terrific review.

>197 baswood: If I ever read Wuthering Heights I will keep your review in mind :)

>197 baswood: - I think this explains it all - Semaphore WH.

Thanks to baswood and Jargoneer, I think I must reread Wuthering Heights for the umpteenth time, this time with an entirely different perspective. Great fun!

I haven't read Wuthering Heights since I was a teenager, and I certainly didn't read it from that perspective!

And now for something completely different:

To Hermione, to Cover Her Breasts

I'm telling you to clothe those shining breasts,
Desist from stirring the insanity of lovers.
Me, congealed already by cold age,
You're heating up unpleasantly. And so
I'm telling you to clothe those shining breasts
And veil your bosom with a decent halter.
Those milky breasts, why carry them about,
Those very nipples, naked and exposed?
Are you really saying "Kiss these breasts,
Caress these glowing breasts." Is that your meaning?
Are you saying "Touch them, touch them, stroke them?"
Do you go out with bosoms all exposed?
Do you stroll around with naked breasts?
I think you're saying "Only ask. They're yours."
Which simply is an invitation to have sex.
And so you'll either clothe those shining nipples
And cover yourself with a decent halter,
Or, though an old man, I'll sweep down on them,
In such a way that I'll seem young to you.
Hermione, those breasts could make Tithonus
Cry out for the remembered tasks of youth.

Giovanni Gioviano Pontano from Baiae translated from latin by Rodney G Dennis.

Baiae near Naples, Italy
Baiae's temperate climate, beautiful scenery and medicinal springs were a big draw for the Romans of antiquity. Many luminaries paid a visit for the attractions of the baths and bathing stations, but there was also an underworld of vice associated with the area. It was also popular in Renaissance times with leading members of the society of the Kingdom of Naples attracted by the baths, the women of easy virtue and the pleasure of stepping in the shoes of famous personages from antiquity.

>187 baswood: - Very informative review of Lost in Translation - you make it sound like a fascinating read.

>197 baswood: - I read one interpretation of Wuthering Heights that suggested that Heathcliff was the bastard son of Mr. Earnshaw (and Catherine and Hindley's half-brother) which would add another layer of incest to the chart.

Baiae by Giovanni Pontano
Giovanni Pontano (1429-1503) had established himself as one of the leading lights in academic circles in the Kingdom of Naples; he was a diplomat and a scholar but his legacy is a series of poems written in Latin, one of which is Baiae, published in 1505. In his introduction Rodney G Dennis says that Pontano was the foremost humanist scholar in Naples; he combined a deep devotion to his wife and family with the liveliest interest in large numbers of romantic alliances, many of which he found at the resort of Baiae. He was never touched by scandal, he was friendly and humorous, entirely without rancor and universally trusted.

There are 71 of his poems in Baiae most of them fairly short and many of them about those famous, perhaps infamous baths. In a poem addressed to his friend Chariteus the last four lines read:

“Happy the baths where Luna bathed
And happy Myrtles where the goddess sports
O happy bed wheron the goddess plays,
Happy Baiae while Chariteus loves!”

It would appear that the circle of friends around Pontano who were members of the "Accademia Pontano" took themselves off to the baths at Baiae to meet their lovers many of whom were prostitutes. Pontano disguises this in his poems by referring to them as goddesses or Nymphes or Graces and many of the names re-appear in the poems. Over half of the poems were addressed to Pontano’s male friends and are mostly concerned with the pleasures on offer at Baiae. Here is a typical example:

“Marullus’s Loves

Tell Muses, which girls my Marullus loves,
Or if any girls love my Marullus back.
Tell me, for he’s sure to be in love
You know what pleasures little girls can give
You know about the Venuses and Cupids
That come forth darting from her eloquent eyes.
Who breathes the scents of Cinnamon and cassia,
Who wields the quiver and the torch of Love?
Goddess Septimilla, fair of form,
She’s the one whom your Marullus loves,
She’s the one who loves him in return.
A happy union! Each burns hot as the other.”

Many of the poems have a languid erotic feel to them, but Pontano can spice them up on occasions but always with a view that “Love is a game, not a time for grief!." Many of his friends like himself were past their prime and so another recurring theme is the affect of age on the libido. The pleasures of feasting and drinking are celebrated, with admonitions not to get too carried away in the beds of their lovers.

There are poems addressed to some of the girls at Baiae as well as a couple to his wife celebrating their life together. A poem celebrating “The marriage of Joannes Broncatus and Maritella” gives advice to Joannes on what he should be doing in the bridal bed, leaving nothing to the imagination. His poem to Alfonso, Duke of Calabria who became King of Naples goes into some detail about his affair with Drusula a lady of the baths, here is an extract:

“And when you recline on her tender breast
And you’re side by side, placing your cheek
By her cheek, one hand
Touching her smooth neck, the other
Stroking those parts that shame conceals,
Soon, after murmurs and mutual cries,
After sighing, after kissing,
Out of your very deepest marrow
The heat subsides, and you lie together,
Spent, languid, quite exhausted,
Don’t you know that your spirit roams
In the heart of your Drusula?
That her spirit runs to yours,
That in both hearts they roam together?
Tell, greatest Duke, tell, blessed lover,
Are not gold and kingdoms cheap?
Are you not one of the Gods?

Pontano’s love and awe of the poets and writers of antiquity comes through with many references and the poetry celebrates paganism and the Gods of the Romans. There are direct quotes and references to Catullus in particular and Martial, which would have been welcomed by Pontano’s circle of friends at the Accademia, who would also have appreciated the “in jokes” that have been lost to us now.

The I Tatti Renaissance Library publication has included the original Latin text facing Rodney G. Dennis’s modern translation. This is useful as the poems were famous for their Hendecasyllabic (11 syllable) lines, which have not been possible to render in the translation and so even if you cannot read the Latin you can see what the poems looked like on the page and also can appreciate the rhyming schemes. There is a good selection of notes and Dennis’s introduction places the poetry in context.

These poems were unique to me in giving a glimpse of an aspect of life of the Italian Renaissance that I have not come across elsewhere. The poems themselves in translation have a sensuous quality that I found quite seductive. There was enough variety and interest to keep me reading straight through the book in two sessions. Not great literature perhaps but there are some gems here. A four star read.

Excellent review, Barry. You have done a great job of introducing Pontano's poetry.

Nice review of Baiae and description of the life of Pontano, Barry. I can't help but wonder what his wife thought about his extramarital activities, though.

All very interesting! Thanks.

Very nice review and some lovely poetry. It's nice to be reminded that eroticism need not be sordid.

Did the introduction say if the poems were published for public or private consumption? They read like the kind of material that the common (wo)man had to be protected from lest they fall into moral stupor. Very interesting.

>212 Jargoneer:

The common (wo)man either could not read or purchase such books...

>213 edwinbcn: - but that never stopped the authorities being worried about what the masses had access to because obviously they could absorb the decadent ideas through a process of osmosis.

Thanks for the interest folks,

Turner, the actual date for publication in print is given as 1505 by Aldus one of the famous very early printers based in Venice and this was two years after Pontano died. I presume the poems existed in manuscript form before this as Rodney G Dennis says they were composed in the last thirty years of Pontano's life. It would have been usual to give the dedicatee a copy of the poem and it has been noted that Pontano did the copies himself in a very good hand. So short answer is they were probably in circulation passed around to friends in the years before they appeared in print.

He would have certainly given his wife a copy of the poems dedicated to her.

Darryl, Dennis says that Pontano's devotion to his wife and family was consistent and well documented, and there appears to have been no secrecy or difficulties associated with his sexual relations with the ladies at the baths.

I note that one of the dedicatees was Leonardus Corvinus, Bishop of Trivento and here is the poem:

Gauran Nymphs, Avernus' neighbours
Dwelling in the healthy waters,
Nymphs who grace the cerulean pools
Which Bacchus and Dione love
You nymphs, my good and trusty friend
Corvinus, bind his hair and brow
With rush and tender violets,
Fresh myrtle and chaste laurel
As, sacred to Phoebus and the Muses,
A known priest, he may enter the baths;
Now groves and winds resound: Corvinus!
And all the shore knows its poet.

Don’t you know that your spirit roams
In the heart of your Drusula?
That her spirit runs to yours,
That in both hearts they roam together?

Ah, it doesn't get more romantic than that, does it? Thanks for sharing.

#206 Thanks Dief for that pointer towards Cathy and Heathcliffe being half brother and sister in Wuthering Heights. It sparked a lively discussion at my book club meeting today, which ended with us all convincing ourselves that it was probably the case. However no one was prepared to re-read the novel with that in mind as we had all found it such a depressing read; good though it is.

Now you have to follow it up with Is Heathcliff a Murderer?

#218 that looks intriguing

Terrific reivew of Baiae. Another door cracked open that I didn't know was there.