Ribbons

What can account for the paucity of ribbon in Folio Society editions? All of my Everymans and my LOAs have them!

don't know, I wish they did use them

I have no idea why either, but I wish they did include ribbons. I use my own ribbon instead, but it has the tendency to imconveniently fall out of the book.

Nah, it's not necessary, I just use a bookmark or anything else lying around. It's much more quicker.

>4 ironjaw:

Agreed. Isn't that what bus tickets were invented for?
I prefer my books without ribbons

>4 ironjaw: How could it be quicker to use something lying around than somethign already attached to the book? I agree it isn't necessary though, but I do like them.

>5 SimB: I'm always using train tickets and receipts :)

A lot of the 'Fine Edition' Folio books have them e.g. the Kelmscott, the recent Dickens set, both editions of the KJV bible, Natural History of Selborne... not sure if Beowulf did (I don't remember there being one).

I would like Folio to put them on their larger editions, but don't think they are very useful on the smaller volumes.

No need for ribbons!
I always make dog-ears in the books I read. I start from the bottom-right, and when re-reading continue with the top-left.
If I find a nice citation I simply fold the page in half and make a small tear in the margin on the exact line where the citation can be found.

>7 islandbooks:

LOL!
No, I'ld love to have ribbons in all my folios over 100 pages. ;-)

>7 islandbooks:,8

If a series of devotees now go into shock, we'll know who to blame :-P

>6 LipstickAndAviators: No ribbon in the Beowulf but I wish there was.

>7 islandbooks: Just had a time warp moment, but no, it is not April 1st

There's another possible solution that won't find much favour here, and that's the very stylish but totally dangerous Folio Society metal book marker. I have two and they stay firmly mounted in their presentation boxes. Could be useful, though, when wielded in a special way not unknown to Hitchcock admirers, for reducing the population of book mutilators exemplified in >7 islandbooks:.

With regard to ribbons, they can be an asset, in prayer books and bibles, for example, where two or three in the same book are be useful. In a new book, they can look very smart and sumptuously silky, but often they don't last more than a couple of generations. (All right, I know that's quite a long time, but I'm thinking of my children's children, when e-readers are antiques and everyone has seen the light and is reading real books again. Well, I can dream, can't I?) I have several very old books in reasonable condition except that the ribbon has virtually rotted away or become detached. What's left looks very dessicated and nasty.

I have many Everyman and EP books with ribbons but not once have I used the ribbons and instead rely on my huge supply of card bookmarkers (my favourites coming from Daunt Bookshop in Marylebone and Kinokunia in Bangkok, which I like to use because they remind me of book shops and places that I like and bring back happy memories). I find the ribbons fiddly to use and a general nuisance. I can live without them.

I like ribbons in the Everyman and LOA books, but I agree with Boldface's comments re:ribbions getting natty over time. I even find it irritating when the ribbon markers in EP books start to fray, which happens relatively early, this happened on my fist read of Les Miserables and I am very careful with my books. I do see the advantage to them though...

>12 boldface:

I couldn't agree more. That exactly why I love the fact that FS doesn't have ribbons. Also, before the it wears out, or loses color/falls out, you have to deal with creases, fraying, and twists in the ribbon. They also tend to fall out of books even it they are attached. I've stuck to pieces of card stock, business cards, or index cards for most of my life and couldn't be happier.

I agree with David. I was reading EP Reader's Choice version of First Men on the Moon yesterday and I hate fiddling with the ribbon. It was irritating. You have to make sure as others have mentioned not to twist or crease the ribbon. And then you have to make sure that the end of the ribbon is tucked in properly

Come to think of it, I have an edition or two of non FS books with double ribbons!

>17 LesMiserables:

What volumes? I think I only have religious and historical texts that have more than one ribbon. I think i may also have seen a dictionary with 2 or 3.

Then again I can't really see a reason for having more than one in a work of fiction, as unless it's something clever or metafictional like Pale Fire they are generally read in a linear fashion from start to finish...

My Oxford Dictionary of Quotations 7th ed. is a good example, and then again I see your point about a novel, unless of course it is a lengthy work. I have quite a few philosophical works which could do with multiple ribbons.

> 18, 19

I have only ever seen religious or technical books with more than one ribbon. But some literary works could benefit from double ribbons where they have extensive notes which you might want to cross refer to at the back of the volume. I use two card bookmarks in my Everyman’s Library edition of Yeats - one for the poems and one for the notes which I follow as I read along.

> 19

I think in fact I bought this from Folio.

> 7,8. Another good thing about the dog-ear method is that you can use it later to reconstruct your reading habits of bygone days. Grandchildren are usually fascinated when you pull out a volume and demonstrate to them how many pages you used to be able to read in one sitting. Neutral observers can also learn much from your dog-ear pattern. For example, a particularly thick section between dog-ears indicates an unusually absorbing section of the book, so interesting that you just couldn't put it down. Conversely, if you see a book with dog-ears on every other page, beware! Slow going ahead.

Dogearing, matricide, buggery..... all one and the same to me :-)

Expulsion to the Colonies, I say!

>20 Quicksilver66:

Ahh, yes. Poetry anthologies are the exact kind of book that could benefit from multiple ribbons. I see your point about literary books with notes too, though I'd probably prefer the notes were within the text, possibly as footnotes, than in a separate section (depending of cours eon how extensive the notes were).

>18 LipstickAndAviators:, 19, 20.. Never thought about it : but I happen to own an exception : Chateaubriand's Memoirs in two slipcased volumes , with two ribbons each, ...

ETA bad joke edited

> 24

I also consider the Dawkins volumes published by FS, as worthy contenders for the multiple ribbon treatment. There are so many interesting cross references that need to be revisited as you progress through his works.

>26 LesMiserables:

I think the science books are a good call.

I could have used multiple ribbons in The History of Western Science. Both The History of Western Philosophy and THe History of Western Music would probably benefit from them too.

I wish the Fairy Books had a ribbon marker. Those and The Andersen Complete Tales I often read a little of at a time and don't to leave a bookmark in them. Plus I think a ribbon on the Fairy Books would be aesthetically pleasing.

> 22 "For example, a particularly thick section between dog-ears indicates an unusually absorbing section of the book, so interesting that you just couldn't put it down. Conversely, if you see a book with dog-ears on every other page, beware! Slow going ahead."

I was sceptical about this until I consulted a forensic cynotobibliographer friend of mine who says he works on cases like this all the time.

First, I generally don't use ribbons. I have a bookmark of my own design (which I make with acid-neutral cardstock) that helps hold the book open while reading, and saves my place even if the book is accidentally closed. However, for a book that has a useful glossary or map or has notes in the back, a ribbon marker is nice for holding that place for quick reference.

As far as the metal FS bookmarks, they are nice for journals or other book-like magazines, but I wouldn't put one in a hardcover book.

Two things to avoid in a bookmark - 1) something that will deform the pages, and 2) something that will discolor the pages (such as newspaper or other acidic paper). It's too easy to forget and leave a bookmark in a book when reshelving. That's why I don't use "whatever's laying around". I have bought many used books in which I later found a paper 'bookmark' which had discolored the pages it was left in contact with. Of course, I also have a book in which the bound-in ribbon marker discolored the pages!!

Os.

> 29 "I have bought many used books in which I later found a paper 'bookmark' which had discolored the pages it was left in contact with."

Beware books which have had newspaper cuttings shoved into them. This practice usually results in horrendous staining!

#29,30:

From time to time I go to the bank and get some freshly printed "5 jiao" bills (equals about US$ 0.08).

They look nice, are printed on high quality acid free paper (as most paper money) and have the right size as bookmark:

>31 J_ipsen:

What an awesome idea, I don't know how I never thought of that. I also have a small collection of coins and bills from when I was younger so that's right up my alley. Where are you from? I have never tried to get any foreign currency from my local bank before so I don't know what/if they exchange there.

Also, does anyone know, or have ideas about, whether or not US currency would stain a book? I know its printed on cotton fiber paper, rather than wood, but I don't know about its acid content. Wikipedia says they may contain small amounts of acid, for 100% cotton paper. However, wikipedia isn't a very good source.

In Australia our 'paper' money is actually made out of plastic, so I'm not sure if that would have an effect on the books too.

#32: I'm from Germany, but live for many years in China now. The smaller denominations of Chinese bills (less than one yuan) are quite beautiful as they show some of the main minorities. The bigger ones have unfortunately been changed to depict grandpa Mao,...but only after his death as he never allowed a bill with his image when he was still alive.

I remember when I was posted to the Falkland Islands / Islas Malvinas, I was taken aback by three things.

1) How much It reminded me of my home in Scotland.
2) How many anti personnel mines were 'floating' around on the beach dunes.
3) How large the currency notes were.

In fact, I think I have just thought of a use for my Kelmscott after all this time.............

On the subject of ribbons (which I like and find useful) I treat them in a particularly quirky way: since they tend to unravel I tie them into a small knot at the end. That also makes them easier to grasp. Hope I'm not expelled from this group for this untoward behaviour...

Oh, drasvola, I was too nervous to admit to doing the same ... thank you for your honesty. =)

I am a tier of book ribbon ends. There, I said it.

As you say it makes them easier to grasp and prohibits unravelling; as I tie them when I first pull the book out for reading, I can tell whether or not I have read a book by the tassel on the shelf. Books with the ribbon still tucked in, I have clearly not read.

Another way of avoiding unravelling is to melt the edge by gently (very gently!) heating it with a lighter. This is not a good idea for natural fibre ribbons, though! They don't melt so much as burn.

(I always thought tassel was spelled tassle. Silly me.)

> 37

Thank you, Ephemeralda. So comforting to know I've company!

Tying knots in ribbons I'm prepared to accept, but setting fire to them . . . . ???!!!!!!

> 39

Which is precisely why I tie knots and don't even try melting the edge. I only melt the edge of ribbons when wrapping pretty pressies for birthdays and Christmas, which is why I know it works.

I wouldn't go anywhere near a book with a lighter.

*breaks into a cold sweat*

> 40

That's a relief! I can put away the smelling salts now!

> 41

Speaking of ...

My daughter was browsing Year Round Things to Do when my renewal package arrived and found the following:

Paper Butterflies
You need thin paper, a postcard, sheet of brown paper, pencil, crayons, glue, cotton, adhesive tape, hot oven or fire.

Her comment? "They don't make books with children's games like these any more".

PS: There is also a game where they assume you have a sword or dagger at hand.

>37 Ephemeralda:/39/40/41

Setting fire in or around books is always a risk. Thankfully, if you melt the end of a ribbon, or piece of rope (that is synthetic fiber), with the use of a hot piece of metal it is called fusing. Fusing the end of a rope, which is where my experience with this lies, does not involve any open flame and results is a very clean and neat rope end that will not unravel.

I feel like I can also get behind tying a knot in a ribbon, good idea btw, even though I am against any other deforming of books. This could be due to the fact that I'm not a super huge fan of ribbons though.

A tiny blob of clear nail polish works just to seal the ribbon end and stop fraying. Much safer than burning .

I often burn the end of shoe laces when the (?) has fallen off and the fabric begins to fray.

(?) = The little plastic hollow tubing that fits over the end of the lace. You know... the thingamajig, the watchamecallit......

>45 LesMiserables: aglet

> 46

Thank you! Well, well, well. For many years......

Was pleasantly surprised to see the beautiful, green, spidery ribbon in the Anansi Boys which arrived this week. I would enjoy more ribbons in future Folio Socety books.

>48 sdawson:
Yes I agree, nice touch.

Stop mucking about with this namby-pamby nonsense.

Once I've read a page I rip it out the book and eat it.

>50 Uppernorwood: The only way to go.

I think Sir Francis Bacon would agree: "Some books are to be tasted, others to be swallowed, and some few to be chewed and digested; "

Bring on the ribbons

Has anyone ever added their own ribbons or is that sacrilegious?

Wish there were more ribbons in Folio books, and was just thinking about gluing in some of my own......

I much prefer books without ribbons, so FS generally not having them is one of the selling points for me.

More ribbons would be nice. To me they're immensely practical and pretty, too.

I always feel they get in the way and are a nuisance. An old subway card, baseball ticket, or even just a receipt from the grocery store suffices.

I like the convenience of ribbons, but quality varies considerably. None of the ribbons in any of my Franklin Library or Centipede volumes seem to have frayed, whereas my record with Tartarus Press is mixed (just thinking over a few of the publishers of books I own that often use ribbons). Everyman’s I find tend to begin unraveling consistently unless I tie them (which works well). In general, it seems like the flatter and smoother the ribbon, the better. I’ve often wondered why bookmakers don’t include some more substantial finishing element to the end of the ribbon to increase the durability. Seems like an obvious improvement.

I am not a fan of ribbon markers. They can leave indents on the pages, fold weirdly, fray after a short period, some even stain pages. I much prefer bookmarks and the ability to decide the theme and even the thickness of said bookmark for the specific paper used.

I dislike ribbon markers, they're a fiddly, dangly nuisance, and can damage pages. They make a book feel cheap. I expect them in Reader's Digest, Franklin Library or Heron editions, but not Folios. Give me a straightforward bookmark any day.

>50 Uppernorwood: But you can easily floss with a ribbon marker after each chapter.

I too have a dislike of ribbons, and as >59 Lady19thC: mentioned they can leave indents on the pages which a number of books in my collection do unfortunately suffer from, most notably in my Sharpe's Birds of Paradise. I prefer not to use any other form of bookmark either, my philosophy is if I don't remember where I got up then I clearly wasn't paying attention.

I like the idea of ribbon markers, but I also have problems with them like >59 Lady19thC: and >61 wongie:. Most noticeably in The Wanderer LE.

>61 wongie: well done you for remembering the page. I just fold down the top corner edge. Makes the page easy to find, especially with the thicker paper in the LEs.

The thing I dislike about ribbons is that they're part of the book and I feel obliged to try to keep them as pristine as possible. This means that each time I finish a reading session, I have to fold the loose end back up and tuck it inside some pages so that it's not hanging out—otherwise it would get all kinds of non-orthogonal creases from being bent under the book at weird angles.

>63 SimB: I just fold down the top corner edge. Makes the page easy to find, especially with the thicker paper in the LEs.

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo !!!!!

Yes, of course I know you were just joking ... you were just joking? :-) :-)

>63 SimB: Please tell us you were joking! My heart skipped a couple of beats!

>65 RogerBlake:
>66 jhicks62:

Well I have been known to do it with cheap paperbacks!